Ceramic Design Group on sat 22 jun 02
on 6/22/02 1:26 PM, BVCuma at bvcuma@PACIFIC.NET.IN wrote:
> I just received my "Technical" ceramic mag today...
> Jonathan has made some statements (I find them vastly stimulating)
> As a publication made available for general (specific?) reading...
> this forum is an appropriate venue to explore the comments.
> Particularly as Jonathan is here to counter.
> ps. Otherwise I enjoyed your article...
> very well done.
Thanks Bruce, for taking the time to comment on my article. I have not yet
received my copy, but I do stand by my statements. I think that there may be
a typo or word problem....
My statement...
"Methods of making pottery do not determine worth, efficiency or
value."
Should read
"Methods of making pottery do not determine worth, efficacy or
value."
I stand by this statement.
As far as posting comments, in this case to yours, I think its time that
these issues rest in their appropriate places. They have been endlessly
debated ad nauseum on this list for many many years. I have been very
up-front and honest about my thinking over many years about pottery making
on and off this list and at times, have been slammed and otherwise berated
by a vocal few, and quite frankly, I don't need this aggravation or even
desire toget into a circular debate on these issues. While I value the list
and respect the comments and views of its participants, the issues I raise
will always stir our thinking and we all certainly can't agree, can we? Its
the diversity of opinion and thinking that nurtures our creative
experiences. I will always continue to speak my truth, as I hope that others
on the list do also. Its all we can ask for.
But as for continuing the either debate, elucidate on, or continue to rework
these issues, I'll resist, as best I can, getting involved again.
Respectfully,
Jonathan
--
Jonathan Kaplan
Ceramic Design Group
PO Box 775112
Steamboat Springs CO 80477
infor@ceramicdesigngroup.net www.ceramicdesigngroup.net
(use PO BOX for all USPS correspondence)
970 879-9139
Plant Location
1280 13th Street
Steamboat Springs CO 80487
(use PLANT LOCATION for all UPS, Common Carrier, and Courier deliveries)
BVCuma on sun 23 jun 02
I just received my "Technical" ceramic mag today...
Jonathan has made some statements (I find them vastly stimulating)
As a publication made available for general (specific?) reading...
this forum is an appropriate venue to explore the comments.
Particularly as Jonathan is here to counter.
As follows...
I quote
"As a potter and ceramic designer, I am not tied to the belief
that there is an ethical pot, or for that matter ethical ways of making =
pottery.
My pottery paradigm changed quite early in my career
when I threw my first gross of mugs.
To me, it does not matter how pottery is made.
What matters is the intent, the design, and its execution.
Whether it is hand thrown , jiggered, slabbed, RAM pressed,
slip cast or pinched these are only just ways of working to convey =
ideas.
Potters wheels, slab rollers, extruders, the hydraulic press
and the jigger/jolley are just the tools and their methodologies
are only ways of working.
What matters are ideas, the capacity for good design and its execution.
These tools these machines, our hands, our eyes, our brains
and capacity to visualize, are just that tools to realize our ideas and =
visions.
Methods of making pottery do not determine worth, efficiency or value."
End Quote...
Wow!!..
>>As a potter and ceramic designer, I am not tied to the belief
that there is an ethical pot, or for that matter ethical ways of making =
pottery<<
Ethics are not labels to be attached to things or processes...
They are intents made by minds to deceive...
or standards by which one lives to realize honesty.
>>To me, it does not matter how pottery is made.
What matters is the intent, the design, and its execution<<
We all have our priorities.
There is a contradiction here you might like to be aware of...
"execution" is the method by which an idea is expressed
and IS in fact "how pottery is made"
All depends on perception.
>>Whether it is hand thrown , jiggered, slabbed, RAM pressed,
slip cast or pinched these are only just ways of working to convey =
ideas<<
>>Potters wheels, slab rollers, extruders, the hydraulic press
and the jigger/jolley are just the tools and their methodologies
are only ways of working.<<
The thrust of your intent here seems to be...
"only ways of working"
Why the reduction in relevance??
It is rather crucial to the discerning eye to perceive the=20
traces of process...
and it is there for anyone who cares to be aware.
"only ways of working"... please reconsider.
>>What matters are ideas, the capacity for good design and its =
execution<<
Nothing really matters...
it all comes down to priorities.
and if you have any senses... awareness.
>>These tools these machines, our hands, our eyes, our brains
and capacity to visualize, are just that tools to realize our ideas and =
visions.<<
I will agree with the analogy..
but the comparison is really useless in this context.
Ideas and their manifestation are hardly
comparative to machines etc...??
>>Methods of making pottery do not determine worth, efficiency or =
value."<<
They certainly do!
ok maybe not efficiency...
but value and worth???
Think about it....
come on..
think about it...
all of it.
Bruce
ps. Otherwise I enjoyed your article...
very well done.
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