Philip Poburka on sun 21 jul 02
...Dear Richard,
Seems to my recollection, that all Cultures as enjoyed their Coffee and also
their Tea, had evolved respective Pots from which to brew and or serve them.
Now, something I know nothing of, and would be curious about, is, seeing as
the
Japanese had been likeing their Coffee for maybe about some Hundred and
fifty years or so...what sort of 'Coffee Pots' did they get up for their
enjoyment of their Coffee?
Anyone know?
It used to be, they had exclusive 'Contracts' for...was it the 'Blue
Lintong' Coffee Beans?...and too, allways, since the 1880s or earlier...for
'so-much' straight 'Virginia-Tobacco', of every year's Crop...as was not
interrupted by anything...ever...but I digress...
That the universal tendency seems to have been to locate the Spout up
'high' for the Coffee-of-Pots, and rather as 'low' for the Tea-of-Pots...
Now maybe there were some exceptions to this as do not come to mind just
now...but...
I have wondered of the 'why' of this too, and I do not seem to find any
certain resolution to this question in my thoughts about it.
Now it seems to me, if I imagine level of the liquid in a Pot as have a
'high' Spout...that when you pour from it, I imagine the 'top' more or less
of the liquid to be finding egress...as it's level gets matched by the tip
of the Spout in tilting the Pot...
Now it seems where we have a 'low' spout...the level of the liquid in the
Pot, is not going to 'pour' untill the tip of the Spout is at the same level
as the top of the liquid...which is the same case for the Pot as have a
Spout on 'high'...but that the Liquid finding egress is from more the
'middle' of the Pot's contents...
So...that's what goes on in my wondering on this...
It is not as 'if' the Coffee Grounds vis-a-vie the Tea Leaves, are more
likely to be floating 'in' the bottom entirely, nor at the 'top'
entirely...certainly
with either, there is (if the Tea Leaves of Coffee Grounds are not
restrained) some tendency for them to lay in some measure, with some respect
to their
negotions with the Specific Gravity in different levels of the Liquid.
In making Coffee, many people used to use a bit of Muslin or other, as so
have a little sachette or 'bag' to keep the grounds together...or...in
making rather of 'boiled' coffee in a stove Pot, would decant that brew into
a Coffee Pot for Table or other service or dispenseings...or not...
Maybe impiricly, it would be found that the flavor is somehow optimum, that
is, in some discreet arrangement of 'Specific Gravity' as may go on 'in' the
settleing of the brew...that certain 'levels' of it are found preferable for
flavour,
and the respective Spouts seek that 'layer'...as well as, that experience
allows some position of the Spout to intend to reduce the probability of
either
'leaves' or 'grounds' finding their way 'out'...
About what you were saying, more or less...just a different elaboration...
What are some of your additional thoughts?
Phil
Las Vegas...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Jeffery"
Subject: Re: June's dislikes
> there is a cultural aspect to tea pot design.
>
> the English are late comers to the brew, comparatively.
>
> look at Arab tea pots - designed to pour a thin long stream of liquid into
a
> small cup - intention seems to be to get as much oxygen into the brew as
> possible, which by all accounts does good things to flavour [think about
> wine tasters]. looks more like what we might expect of a coffee pot, with
> long thing spout.
>
> we still struggle with the idea that foodstuffs need to be completely dead
> before ingestion, so like cabbage, tea must be reduced over a period of
time
> to something brown. our teapot design has to do with capacity - we drink
> large amounts from big cups [unless we have the vicar to tea] - and hence
> the need to balance a not inconsiderable weight around the axes of a
perhaps
> delicate wrist.
>
>
> right - time for breakfast [well, it is Sunday], finish some work for a
show
> on Wednesday, then i'll think some more about wine tasting......
>
> cheers
>
> Richard
>
>
>
> Richard Jeffery
>
> Web Design and Photography
> www.theeleventhweb.co.uk
> Bournemouth UK
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ceramic Arts Discussion List [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]On
> Behalf Of Bacia Edelman
> Sent: 21 July 2002 01:25
> To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Subject: June's dislikes
>
>
> Or I shd. use her subject: Re: 10 points for the ignorant.
> June Perry wrote:
>
> >>Another thing is teapots -- I prefer the spout being closer to the base
of
> the pot so that when you pour, you are getting the stronger tea first. If
> the spout it at the top of the pot, by the time you get to the bottom of
the
> pot you have a very strong, unpleasant decoction of bitter tea.<<
>
> Well, we should get Janet Kaiser in on this. She once wrote about
> the proper way to make tea. And I picked up most of her habits when
> we lived in London. But she did mention stirring the contents of the pot
> after steeping. Therefore, Janet or any of you other mavens of tea-
> drinking, wouldn't the post-steeping
> stirring obviate the bitterness of the tea
> as the pot was drained? Maybe June has long, long conversations
> over her tea.
> Anyway, when I make teapots that are supposed to be functional, I
> do not place the spouts near the bottom. When I make the hand-built
> kind that are artsy-fartsy (or that might get into shows), the best
> ones seem to have a long spout starting near the base. On clayart,
> not too long ago, David Hendley decried the practice of placing
> spouts near the base of teapots.
> I think it affected the one
> I made a couple weeks ago. It was sculptural and though it
> could function, is meant for a gallery invite, if it comes out
> well from glaze firing.
> Just my input. We can't all agree!!
> Bacia
>
>
>
>
> Bacia Edelman Madison, Wisconsin
> http://users.skynet.be/russel.fouts/bacia.htm
> http://www.silverhawk5.com/edelman/index.html
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
> __
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Richard Jeffery on mon 22 jul 02
to complicate things on the coffee front, there is another model of pot,
although i do not know its history - probably relatively modern.
in France coffee is not stewed - water is passed through fine grounds once,
held in a filter above the pot. although Melitta makes them in plastic,
earlier version are for a ceramic filter that sits on the lid gallery, to be
replace when the filter has run through.
i know this has little to do with spout design - but is the antithesis of
leaving coffee grounds in the body of the pot - and makes exceedingly fine
coffee.......
perhaps we should get some glass blowers to knock up some different models,
attach them to suitable pivots and film the action of brewing and pouring,
ready for some flow analysis...
i expect it's already been done somewhere.... you could add small
reflective balls with neutral flotation to add to the filming, and to give
the computer modeller something to hang on to....
glad i just make clocks, me - don't have to worry about all of
this..........
cheers
Richard
Richard Jeffery
Web Design and Photography
www.theeleventhweb.co.uk
Bournemouth UK
-----Original Message-----
From: Ceramic Arts Discussion List [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]On
Behalf Of Philip Poburka
Sent: 21 July 2002 23:51
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: June's dislikes - Richard's thoughts elaborated on...
...Dear Richard,
Seems to my recollection, that all Cultures as enjoyed their Coffee and also
their Tea, had evolved respective Pots from which to brew and or serve them.
Now, something I know nothing of, and would be curious about, is, seeing as
the
Japanese had been likeing their Coffee for maybe about some Hundred and
fifty years or so...what sort of 'Coffee Pots' did they get up for their
enjoyment of their Coffee?
Anyone know?
It used to be, they had exclusive 'Contracts' for...was it the 'Blue
Lintong' Coffee Beans?...and too, allways, since the 1880s or earlier...for
'so-much' straight 'Virginia-Tobacco', of every year's Crop...as was not
interrupted by anything...ever...but I digress...
That the universal tendency seems to have been to locate the Spout up
'high' for the Coffee-of-Pots, and rather as 'low' for the Tea-of-Pots...
Now maybe there were some exceptions to this as do not come to mind just
now...but...
I have wondered of the 'why' of this too, and I do not seem to find any
certain resolution to this question in my thoughts about it.
Now it seems to me, if I imagine level of the liquid in a Pot as have a
'high' Spout...that when you pour from it, I imagine the 'top' more or less
of the liquid to be finding egress...as it's level gets matched by the tip
of the Spout in tilting the Pot...
Now it seems where we have a 'low' spout...the level of the liquid in the
Pot, is not going to 'pour' untill the tip of the Spout is at the same level
as the top of the liquid...which is the same case for the Pot as have a
Spout on 'high'...but that the Liquid finding egress is from more the
'middle' of the Pot's contents...
So...that's what goes on in my wondering on this...
It is not as 'if' the Coffee Grounds vis-a-vie the Tea Leaves, are more
likely to be floating 'in' the bottom entirely, nor at the 'top'
entirely...certainly
with either, there is (if the Tea Leaves of Coffee Grounds are not
restrained) some tendency for them to lay in some measure, with some respect
to their
negotions with the Specific Gravity in different levels of the Liquid.
In making Coffee, many people used to use a bit of Muslin or other, as so
have a little sachette or 'bag' to keep the grounds together...or...in
making rather of 'boiled' coffee in a stove Pot, would decant that brew into
a Coffee Pot for Table or other service or dispenseings...or not...
Maybe impiricly, it would be found that the flavor is somehow optimum, that
is, in some discreet arrangement of 'Specific Gravity' as may go on 'in' the
settleing of the brew...that certain 'levels' of it are found preferable for
flavour,
and the respective Spouts seek that 'layer'...as well as, that experience
allows some position of the Spout to intend to reduce the probability of
either
'leaves' or 'grounds' finding their way 'out'...
About what you were saying, more or less...just a different elaboration...
What are some of your additional thoughts?
Phil
Las Vegas...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Jeffery"
Subject: Re: June's dislikes
> there is a cultural aspect to tea pot design.
>
> the English are late comers to the brew, comparatively.
>
> look at Arab tea pots - designed to pour a thin long stream of liquid into
a
> small cup - intention seems to be to get as much oxygen into the brew as
> possible, which by all accounts does good things to flavour [think about
> wine tasters]. looks more like what we might expect of a coffee pot, with
> long thing spout.
>
> we still struggle with the idea that foodstuffs need to be completely dead
> before ingestion, so like cabbage, tea must be reduced over a period of
time
> to something brown. our teapot design has to do with capacity - we drink
> large amounts from big cups [unless we have the vicar to tea] - and hence
> the need to balance a not inconsiderable weight around the axes of a
perhaps
> delicate wrist.
>
>
> right - time for breakfast [well, it is Sunday], finish some work for a
show
> on Wednesday, then i'll think some more about wine tasting......
>
> cheers
>
> Richard
>
>
>
> Richard Jeffery
>
> Web Design and Photography
> www.theeleventhweb.co.uk
> Bournemouth UK
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ceramic Arts Discussion List [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]On
> Behalf Of Bacia Edelman
> Sent: 21 July 2002 01:25
> To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Subject: June's dislikes
>
>
> Or I shd. use her subject: Re: 10 points for the ignorant.
> June Perry wrote:
>
> >>Another thing is teapots -- I prefer the spout being closer to the base
of
> the pot so that when you pour, you are getting the stronger tea first. If
> the spout it at the top of the pot, by the time you get to the bottom of
the
> pot you have a very strong, unpleasant decoction of bitter tea.<<
>
> Well, we should get Janet Kaiser in on this. She once wrote about
> the proper way to make tea. And I picked up most of her habits when
> we lived in London. But she did mention stirring the contents of the pot
> after steeping. Therefore, Janet or any of you other mavens of tea-
> drinking, wouldn't the post-steeping
> stirring obviate the bitterness of the tea
> as the pot was drained? Maybe June has long, long conversations
> over her tea.
> Anyway, when I make teapots that are supposed to be functional, I
> do not place the spouts near the bottom. When I make the hand-built
> kind that are artsy-fartsy (or that might get into shows), the best
> ones seem to have a long spout starting near the base. On clayart,
> not too long ago, David Hendley decried the practice of placing
> spouts near the base of teapots.
> I think it affected the one
> I made a couple weeks ago. It was sculptural and though it
> could function, is meant for a gallery invite, if it comes out
> well from glaze firing.
> Just my input. We can't all agree!!
> Bacia
>
>
>
>
> Bacia Edelman Madison, Wisconsin
> http://users.skynet.be/russel.fouts/bacia.htm
> http://www.silverhawk5.com/edelman/index.html
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
> __
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
____________________________________________________________________________
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
| |
|
