Dave Finkelnburg on mon 11 nov 02
Hi all,
I have been back from China for a week now, and I'm still trying to make
sense of my trip there. Funny, but visiting China doesn't seem like a big
deal, now. A month ago, though, the thought was gut-wrenching.
There was no good reason it should have been. I had been in the third
world before,
been in countries where I didn't speak the language, been in countries where
I didn't know the culture. It was just the totality of the unknowns that
had me seriously anxious. Well, I grossly underestimated the unknowns. :-)
I saw so many new things that every day seemed a week long! I had so much
fun...
First, though, the logistics. Early this year I saw a ClayArt posting
from Guangzhen "Po" Zhou. He would lead a tour of China in October. It
included a ceramics conference in a city called Foshan. I procrastinated,
thought, reconsidered when I saw a second posting for a shorter, two-week
tour, checked out some references, and wildly signed up! Eight others did
likewise. We were to visit Shanghai, Hangzhou, Xi'an and Beijing, also.
We flew into Guangzhou (used to be called Canton), thirty minutes from
Foshan, and landed in the lap of a serious clay conference. Big name clay
artists from the U.S., Europe and the Orient were there. We saw ceramic art
exhibit openings, a tile and whiteware trade show, listened to international
clay artists give prepared talks with slides, all the while bombarded by the
sights, sounds and smells of the Pearl River delta city that is Foshan.
Conference sessions made me feel like I was at the United Nations. We
listened on headphones to English and Chinese speakers' words translated
simultaneously to the other's language. Everywhere were potteries, tile
factories, clay work in progress from studio to industrial scale.
Two evenings we sat around restaurant tables in a courtyard beside a
several-hundred year-old wood-fired climbing kiln, eating, and drinking beer
and tea and water, and talking till after midnight. In that group, with
people from both Chinas, Korea, Australia, Canada, Mexico, Norway, Denmark,
Spain, Greece, Germany...where the common language was art and clay...then I
felt in totally familiar surroundings.
During my visit to China I began to absorb what must be learned by most
beginning art students, that what we usually see as Chinese art is work made
for a succession of emperors over the last 2,200 years. As in Korea and
Japan, conformance and following tradition are highly valued in China. This
was summed up for me by an older Chinese student who commented in one
conference session, "It is easier for you to make original art in the West.
You do not have the cultural burden we have in China." For the record, I
saw highly original, exceptionally good, ceramic art in China. For being in
a country of 1.3-billion people, though, such art was hard to find. Current
ceramic art duplicating the work of Imperial artists of the last two
millennia is much more in evidence.
I could go on about the details of our tour, but I'll be kind and spare
you. Suffice it to say: all Chinese cities are a combination of the first,
second and third world rolled into one; Shanghai is being transformed by an
incredible building program; Beijing is a modern city without Shanghai's
glitz; the Shanghai museum is THE place to see a complete exhibit of Chinese
pottery; the Forbidden City in Beijing is number two on that list besides
being a day's worth of things to look at by itself; Chinese expressways are
thoroughly modern, and Chinese airlines and airports are, too; eating in
China is familiar and easy, only exotic if you choose, but you'll be more
comfortable if you learn to use chop sticks; if you do everything first
class you'll always pay "foreigner prices," but if you poke around you can
buy most things at the much lower prices the Chinese pay; negotiating prices
is expected in many smaller shops, adding a lot of richness to gift
shopping; the Great Wall looks fine in pictures but you'll never truly
appreciate it until you feel it by walking on it yourself; and the terra
cotta warriors and horses in the Emperor Qin's army, excavated and on
display near Xi'an, are so impressive they can move you to tears...at least
they did me.
So what do I remember most about China? The people. The eight others I
traveled with, Stan Welsh, Tom and Geri Kerrigan, Dennis and Greg Parks,
John Fahnestock and Sandro and Daniela Lorenzini were great. They were at
times helpful, cheerful, insightful. My trip was much richer for them! Our
guide, Guangzhen Zhou, aka "Po," was unflappably patient, and constantly
caring, diligent and cheerful. Above all, the Chinese people, wherever we
were, treated us with warmth and kindness. The China I saw is certainly not
America. It's unlike any place I've ever been. Its people, though, made me
want to return.
Dave Finkelnburg, on a sunny-crisp fall day here, trying to make
Idaho pots while visions of China race through my head
P.S. If you really are a glutton for punishment, and want to hear
more details about this trip, send me a note off-list. I have a few e-mails
here that I sent home, plus some notes, and I can forward them to you.
David Beumee on tue 12 nov 02
Hi Dave,
I remember talking to you outside the Clayart room after the clay body
breakout session at NCECA in March. Hope you received the materials.
The trip to China sounded great! What a wounderful opportunity.
I'd like to know more.
David Beumee
11/11/02 11:30:04 PM, Dave Finkelnburg wrote:
>Hi all,
> I have been back from China for a week now, and I'm still trying to make
>sense of my trip there. Funny, but visiting China doesn't seem like a big
>deal, now. A month ago, though, the thought was gut-wrenching.
> There was no good reason it should have been. I had been in the third
>world before,
>been in countries where I didn't speak the language, been in countries where
>I didn't know the culture. It was just the totality of the unknowns that
>had me seriously anxious. Well, I grossly underestimated the unknowns. :-)
>I saw so many new things that every day seemed a week long! I had so much
>fun...
> First, though, the logistics. Early this year I saw a ClayArt posting
>from Guangzhen "Po" Zhou. He would lead a tour of China in October. It
>included a ceramics conference in a city called Foshan. I procrastinated,
>thought, reconsidered when I saw a second posting for a shorter, two-week
>tour, checked out some references, and wildly signed up! Eight others did
>likewise. We were to visit Shanghai, Hangzhou, Xi'an and Beijing, also.
> We flew into Guangzhou (used to be called Canton), thirty minutes from
>Foshan, and landed in the lap of a serious clay conference. Big name clay
>artists from the U.S., Europe and the Orient were there. We saw ceramic art
>exhibit openings, a tile and whiteware trade show, listened to international
>clay artists give prepared talks with slides, all the while bombarded by the
>sights, sounds and smells of the Pearl River delta city that is Foshan.
>Conference sessions made me feel like I was at the United Nations. We
>listened on headphones to English and Chinese speakers' words translated
>simultaneously to the other's language. Everywhere were potteries, tile
>factories, clay work in progress from studio to industrial scale.
> Two evenings we sat around restaurant tables in a courtyard beside a
>several-hundred year-old wood-fired climbing kiln, eating, and drinking beer
>and tea and water, and talking till after midnight. In that group, with
>people from both Chinas, Korea, Australia, Canada, Mexico, Norway, Denmark,
>Spain, Greece, Germany...where the common language was art and clay...then I
>felt in totally familiar surroundings.
> During my visit to China I began to absorb what must be learned by most
>beginning art students, that what we usually see as Chinese art is work made
>for a succession of emperors over the last 2,200 years. As in Korea and
>Japan, conformance and following tradition are highly valued in China. This
>was summed up for me by an older Chinese student who commented in one
>conference session, "It is easier for you to make original art in the West.
>You do not have the cultural burden we have in China." For the record, I
>saw highly original, exceptionally good, ceramic art in China. For being in
>a country of 1.3-billion people, though, such art was hard to find. Current
>ceramic art duplicating the work of Imperial artists of the last two
>millennia is much more in evidence.
> I could go on about the details of our tour, but I'll be kind and spare
>you. Suffice it to say: all Chinese cities are a combination of the first,
>second and third world rolled into one; Shanghai is being transformed by an
>incredible building program; Beijing is a modern city without Shanghai's
>glitz; the Shanghai museum is THE place to see a complete exhibit of Chinese
>pottery; the Forbidden City in Beijing is number two on that list besides
>being a day's worth of things to look at by itself; Chinese expressways are
>thoroughly modern, and Chinese airlines and airports are, too; eating in
>China is familiar and easy, only exotic if you choose, but you'll be more
>comfortable if you learn to use chop sticks; if you do everything first
>class you'll always pay "foreigner prices," but if you poke around you can
>buy most things at the much lower prices the Chinese pay; negotiating prices
>is expected in many smaller shops, adding a lot of richness to gift
>shopping; the Great Wall looks fine in pictures but you'll never truly
>appreciate it until you feel it by walking on it yourself; and the terra
>cotta warriors and horses in the Emperor Qin's army, excavated and on
>display near Xi'an, are so impressive they can move you to tears...at least
>they did me.
> So what do I remember most about China? The people. The eight others I
>traveled with, Stan Welsh, Tom and Geri Kerrigan, Dennis and Greg Parks,
>John Fahnestock and Sandro and Daniela Lorenzini were great. They were at
>times helpful, cheerful, insightful. My trip was much richer for them! Our
>guide, Guangzhen Zhou, aka "Po," was unflappably patient, and constantly
>caring, diligent and cheerful. Above all, the Chinese people, wherever we
>were, treated us with warmth and kindness. The China I saw is certainly not
>America. It's unlike any place I've ever been. Its people, though, made me
>want to return.
> Dave Finkelnburg, on a sunny-crisp fall day here, trying to make
>Idaho pots while visions of China race through my head
> P.S. If you really are a glutton for punishment, and want to hear
>more details about this trip, send me a note off-list. I have a few e-mails
>here that I sent home, plus some notes, and I can forward them to you.
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
>
Carol Tripp on tue 12 nov 02
At the end of Dave's long and very interesting message about his trip to
China, he wrote:
P.S. If you really are a glutton for punishment, and want to hear
>more details about this trip, send me a note off-list. I have a few
>e-mails
>here that I sent home, plus some notes, and I can forward them to you.
Dave,
Recently someone sent a day by day record of his trip to a pottery-making
village in Mexico. It was the best thing on Clayart at the time. I bet
most of us would love more details of your China trip. And for the rest,
well, there is Delete. If you are too bashful, could you send me details of
your trip off list?
Thanks and welcome back.
Best regards,
Carol
Dubai, UAE
_________________________________________________________________
Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail
mou10man@STARGATE.NET on tue 12 nov 02
Hi Dave,
I'm a glutton for punishment. Send them on!
Seriously, I've read a number of "potters' trips through China" and most
are terribly bombastic. Yours is down to earth and personal, and therefore
worth reading. I look forward to hearing more about this trip.
I'm glad it turned out to be good for you. Now the question is how, if at
all, it is going to change your own work.
Bonnie
> Hi all,
> I have been back from China for a week now, and I'm still trying to
> make
> sense of my trip there. Funny, but visiting China doesn't seem like a big
> deal, now. A month ago, though, the thought was gut-wrenching.
> There was no good reason it should have been. I had been in the third
> world before,
> been in countries where I didn't speak the language, been in countries
> where
> I didn't know the culture. It was just the totality of the unknowns that
> had me seriously anxious. Well, I grossly underestimated the unknowns.
> :-)
> I saw so many new things that every day seemed a week long! I had so much
> fun...
> First, though, the logistics. Early this year I saw a ClayArt posting
> from Guangzhen "Po" Zhou. He would lead a tour of China in October. It
> included a ceramics conference in a city called Foshan. I procrastinated,
> thought, reconsidered when I saw a second posting for a shorter, two-week
> tour, checked out some references, and wildly signed up! Eight others did
> likewise. We were to visit Shanghai, Hangzhou, Xi'an and Beijing, also.
> We flew into Guangzhou (used to be called Canton), thirty minutes from
> Foshan, and landed in the lap of a serious clay conference. Big name clay
> artists from the U.S., Europe and the Orient were there. We saw ceramic
> art
> exhibit openings, a tile and whiteware trade show, listened to
> international
> clay artists give prepared talks with slides, all the while bombarded by
> the
> sights, sounds and smells of the Pearl River delta city that is Foshan.
> Conference sessions made me feel like I was at the United Nations. We
> listened on headphones to English and Chinese speakers' words translated
> simultaneously to the other's language. Everywhere were potteries, tile
> factories, clay work in progress from studio to industrial scale.
> Two evenings we sat around restaurant tables in a courtyard beside a
> several-hundred year-old wood-fired climbing kiln, eating, and drinking
> beer
> and tea and water, and talking till after midnight. In that group, with
> people from both Chinas, Korea, Australia, Canada, Mexico, Norway,
> Denmark,
> Spain, Greece, Germany...where the common language was art and clay...then
> I
> felt in totally familiar surroundings.
> During my visit to China I began to absorb what must be learned by
> most
> beginning art students, that what we usually see as Chinese art is work
> made
> for a succession of emperors over the last 2,200 years. As in Korea and
> Japan, conformance and following tradition are highly valued in China.
> This
> was summed up for me by an older Chinese student who commented in one
> conference session, "It is easier for you to make original art in the
> West.
> You do not have the cultural burden we have in China." For the record, I
> saw highly original, exceptionally good, ceramic art in China. For being
> in
> a country of 1.3-billion people, though, such art was hard to find.
> Current
> ceramic art duplicating the work of Imperial artists of the last two
> millennia is much more in evidence.
> I could go on about the details of our tour, but I'll be kind and
> spare
> you. Suffice it to say: all Chinese cities are a combination of the
> first,
> second and third world rolled into one; Shanghai is being transformed by
> an
> incredible building program; Beijing is a modern city without Shanghai's
> glitz; the Shanghai museum is THE place to see a complete exhibit of
> Chinese
> pottery; the Forbidden City in Beijing is number two on that list besides
> being a day's worth of things to look at by itself; Chinese expressways
> are
> thoroughly modern, and Chinese airlines and airports are, too; eating in
> China is familiar and easy, only exotic if you choose, but you'll be more
> comfortable if you learn to use chop sticks; if you do everything first
> class you'll always pay "foreigner prices," but if you poke around you can
> buy most things at the much lower prices the Chinese pay; negotiating
> prices
> is expected in many smaller shops, adding a lot of richness to gift
> shopping; the Great Wall looks fine in pictures but you'll never truly
> appreciate it until you feel it by walking on it yourself; and the terra
> cotta warriors and horses in the Emperor Qin's army, excavated and on
> display near Xi'an, are so impressive they can move you to tears...at
> least
> they did me.
> So what do I remember most about China? The people. The eight others
> I
> traveled with, Stan Welsh, Tom and Geri Kerrigan, Dennis and Greg Parks,
> John Fahnestock and Sandro and Daniela Lorenzini were great. They were at
> times helpful, cheerful, insightful. My trip was much richer for them!
> Our
> guide, Guangzhen Zhou, aka "Po," was unflappably patient, and constantly
> caring, diligent and cheerful. Above all, the Chinese people, wherever we
> were, treated us with warmth and kindness. The China I saw is certainly
> not
> America. It's unlike any place I've ever been. Its people, though, made
> me
> want to return.
> Dave Finkelnburg, on a sunny-crisp fall day here, trying to make
> Idaho pots while visions of China race through my head
> P.S. If you really are a glutton for punishment, and want to hear
> more details about this trip, send me a note off-list. I have a few
> e-mails
> here that I sent home, plus some notes, and I can forward them to you.
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
Elca Branman on tue 12 nov 02
I want to hear more about China, and suspect we all would enjoy
vicariously your experience
Elca Branman,in Sarasota Florida
elcab1@juno.com
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BRAX Ltd. on thu 14 nov 02
Yes, having traveled to China, and my husband goes all the time, we have
found the people to be very friendly and kind. It is a very different
country from the US, but the changes and modernization just since we started
going to now is incredible (about five years).
The first time we went, it was to a "small" city of 750,000 people. They
were building their roads with strictly HAND TOOLS. Pick axes, shovels, etc.
Now that same city looks like it has fast forwarded about a half
century--still not modern by our terms, but they are making progress.
Don't pass up an opportunity to go there if you have the chance.
Janice in NC
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