Elizabeth Fisher on wed 13 nov 02
I am putting some pieces (non-functional) in a local craft/art show
where a portion of proceeds benefits the local learning center and
the rest goes to the artist. This is my first "show". I have NO idea
how to price these pieces. My first instinct is to say "make an
offer". Any ideas on how to approach pricing? Thanks, Liz Fisher,
Eastern Shore of Maryland, USA
Buonaiuto on thu 14 nov 02
>
> I am putting some pieces (non-functional) in a local craft/art show
> where a portion of proceeds benefits the local learning center and
> the rest goes to the artist. This is my first "show". I have NO idea
> how to price these pieces. My first instinct is to say "make an
> offer". Any ideas on how to approach pricing? Thanks, Liz Fisher,
> Eastern Shore of Maryland, USA
>
How long do they take you to make? What is the expense of clay, glazing and
firing and the amount of time to prepare these materials, and the expense of
your studio? How much do you need in order to be able to live and continue
working? How much can you get for them? Also, if this is a "local" benefit
type show, you may expect to get less than you would at a high-end craft
show where people go expecting to pay top prices for juried work. Look
around and see what pieces are selling for. And in the end, I see nothing
wrong with a little haggling. I do it all the time, even in the high-end
shows.
Best of luck with your show.
Shelley
Jeremy McLeod on thu 14 nov 02
Elizabeth Fisher wrote:
> Any ideas on how to approach pricing?
Well, a couple of ideas do come to mind (being in the church biz
does indeed, de facto, make one a not-for-profit fundraiser).
You say "a portion" goes to the charity. Do you want to bear
that cost and make the donation to the charity yourself? Do you
want the customer to make that donation? Do you want to share
the cost.
Answers to such questions will dictate whether you price as you
usually would or increase your prices and by how much.
Hmmmm. I'm also wondering how it would be received if the
price tag on a work at such an event indicated the split so that
a customer would know how much their purchase supports
both the artist and the cause.
Jeremy
Snail Scott on thu 14 nov 02
At 07:46 PM 11/13/02 -0500, you wrote:
>I am putting some pieces (non-functional) in a local craft/art show...I
have NO idea
>how to price these pieces. My first instinct is to say "make an
>offer".
No, you really need to put an actual price.
The value of any work of art is still what
people are willing to pay, though. So how
do you find out what that is? Look at other
work which is comparable to yours. 'Shop
around'. Look at the prices for work of like
size, complexity, skill, etc, made by local
artists who aren't much more famous than you.
This will get you into the approximate
range. Then you can look at your work and
'fine-tune' the price from there. Deciding
what work is similar enough to compare can
be the hard part - after all, nobody's stuff
is like yours - but it's the most valid and
reasonable method I know.
-Snail
Snail Scott on thu 14 nov 02
At 08:48 AM 11/14/02 -0700, you wrote:
>How long do they take you to make? What is the expense of clay, glazing and
>firing and the amount of time to prepare these materials, and the expense of
>your studio? How much do you need in order to be able to live and continue
>working?
In a just and righteous universe, all these things
would matter in pricing. But they don't. Period.
If you make something out of expensive materials
and spend 100 hours on it, it won't raise the
price of the object UNLESS THE END RESULT IS WORTH
IT! Only the market can determine a price.
I am not a good thrower, and do it only occasionally.
It would probably take me 10 times longer to produce
one coffee mug than it does for David or Tommy to make
one. And my materials were probably more expensive,
too, since I buy in smaller quantities. I can price
my mug at 10 times what Tommy does, but I probably
won't be able to sell it for that. Neither effort
expended nor cost incurred can be translated into a
viable selling price.
You can put any price on your work that you wish, but
unless people are willing to pay that price for it,
it's not a real price, it's a daydream. Sometimes
I'll drop in on an amateur show, and see some piece
priced at $10,000; about $9,500 more than the next
most expensive comparable piece. The artist will say,
"Well, I put a zillion hours into getting that bit
there just right, and hey, maybe someone will buy it
for that". Well, they won't. And it labels that artist
as strictly 'not ready for prime time'.
So, do none of those factors matter for anything? Of
course they do! But not in pricing. Where they matter
is when you are deciding if you can afford to make
such work at all. If the time and money required to
produce a piece would make any reasonable selling
price into slave wages for you, then you have a few
choices: (A) You can continue to make the work,
selling it for a market price and earning a pittance.
(B) You can make the work and keep it, saying that
your payment is in the joy of making it - and then go
to your day job to pay the rent. (C) You can change
the way you work, or your materials, to bring the
cost of production closer in line with the selling
price. (D) You can change the work (or your market),
bringing the potential price closer in line with your
costs.
Ceramics is often prone to the reverse of this - we
say, "Hey, it's just dirt and my time; not worth
much". If you are one of the rare souls whose cost
of production (materials AND time) are really low,
that doesn't make your work worth less than that of
someone whose costs are more typical. Your work is
STILL worth what the market will bear. Don't undersell.
It's silly not to represent your work at its actual
worth, even if you've got a great thing going in
terms of production cost.
The selling price of a piece is what people think
it's worth. We can argue about 'value' all day, but
price is a different thing. Your cost in time and
materials is simply not a factor. Period.
-Snail
Elizabeth Fisher on thu 14 nov 02
Thank you Jeremy. The Learning Center takes 25%. I would think that
it would be a good thing to put on the ticket. I think I do see what
you're saying - that I
am making that donation and "short changing myself" unless I "over
price" piece to compensate - or do somewhere in between. OK, that
point taken.
I suppose I can also cruise around shops and galleries in the area to
get a feel for prices, but since mine are hand-built and
nonfunctional,there aren't many comparables. As a beginner, I really
am clueless.
Any other ideas on how to approach pricing would be appreciated.
Liz Fisher, Eastern Shore of Maryland
>Elizabeth Fisher wrote:
>
>> Any ideas on how to approach pricing?
>
>Well, a couple of ideas do come to mind (being in the church biz
>does indeed, de facto, make one a not-for-profit fundraiser).
>
>You say "a portion" goes to the charity. Do you want to bear
>that cost and make the donation to the charity yourself? Do you
>want the customer to make that donation? Do you want to share
>the cost.
>
>Answers to such questions will dictate whether you price as you
>usually would or increase your prices and by how much.
>
>Hmmmm. I'm also wondering how it would be received if the
>price tag on a work at such an event indicated the split so that
>a customer would know how much their purchase supports
>both the artist and the cause.
>
>Jeremy
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>melpots@pclink.com.
Elizabeth Herod on thu 14 nov 02
What great advice Snail! I wish I had known this before I priced a piece a=
t
1/8 of its worth, and 1/4 of what the market would bear. (It was 18 inches
tall, with a bamboo texture, handbuilt, 4 inches in diameter.) I learned
from my mistake, and at least I have a picture of it. I had made it for
Ikebana, and for my purposes, I felt I had made a mistake in the color. I
used 20th century base, dipped from both ends with an overlap. The glaze
did exactly what it was supposed to do, but I found that I needed to use re=
d
leaves in an arrangement, so I put it in the student show. The curator
called to tell me that I sold it for =B3an incredibly modest price=B2. Only
afterwards did I realize considering the other pieces that were sold, what =
a
mistake I had made. I just did not have the confidence in my work. Live
and learn
Beth
Snail wrote:
In a just and righteous universe, all these things
would matter in pricing. But they don't. Period.
If you make something out of expensive materials
and spend 100 hours on it, it won't raise the
price of the object UNLESS THE END RESULT IS WORTH
IT! Only the market can determine a price.
I am not a good thrower, and do it only occasionally.
It would probably take me 10 times longer to produce
one coffee mug than it does for David or Tommy to make
one. And my materials were probably more expensive,
too, since I buy in smaller quantities. I can price
my mug at 10 times what Tommy does, but I probably
won't be able to sell it for that. Neither effort
expended nor cost incurred can be translated into a
viable selling price.
You can put any price on your work that you wish, but
unless people are willing to pay that price for it,
it's not a real price, it's a daydream. Sometimes
I'll drop in on an amateur show, and see some piece
priced at $10,000; about $9,500 more than the next
most expensive comparable piece. The artist will say,
"Well, I put a zillion hours into getting that bit
there just right, and hey, maybe someone will buy it
for that". Well, they won't. And it labels that artist
as strictly 'not ready for prime time'.
So, do none of those factors matter for anything? Of
course they do! But not in pricing. Where they matter
is when you are deciding if you can afford to make
such work at all. If the time and money required to
produce a piece would make any reasonable selling
price into slave wages for you, then you have a few
choices: (A) You can continue to make the work,
selling it for a market price and earning a pittance.
(B) You can make the work and keep it, saying that
your payment is in the joy of making it - and then go
to your day job to pay the rent. (C) You can change
the way you work, or your materials, to bring the
cost of production closer in line with the selling
price. (D) You can change the work (or your market),
bringing the potential price closer in line with your
costs.
Ceramics is often prone to the reverse of this - we
say, "Hey, it's just dirt and my time; not worth
much". If you are one of the rare souls whose cost
of production (materials AND time) are really low,
that doesn't make your work worth less than that of
someone whose costs are more typical. Your work is
STILL worth what the market will bear. Don't undersell.
It's silly not to represent your work at its actual
worth, even if you've got a great thing going in
terms of production cost.
The selling price of a piece is what people think
it's worth. We can argue about 'value' all day, but
price is a different thing. Your cost in time and
materials is simply not a factor. Period.
-Snail
___________________________________________________________________________=
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__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
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