Philip Poburka on sat 28 dec 02
Earls post...
Dear Earl, or anyone...
Please tell me what the 'damages' were as the artist caused?
What was the actual harm?
My recollection is that no mention was ever made of anyone
having any problem with it in any way, the 'boxes' were
taped to a peripheral wall, and were not in anyone's way.
I gathered that the authorities over-reacted.
No mention as from the actual event said anything about
anyone being freightened, upset or inconvenienced in any
way.
The only inconvenience mentioned stemmed frrom the
over-reaction of the 'authorities'.
There were other no problems of any kind that I heard of.
Tell me Earl, What is it he should be 'Jailed' for?
What was the 'harm'?
Thanks...
Phil
Las Vegas
----- Original Message -----
From: "Earl Brunner"
To:
Sent: Saturday, December 28, 2002 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: youthful arrogance/ black boxes/special
treatment for artists
I've been thinking (there's a shocker) and I think that if
he fulfilled
the requirements for an "A" he should have received an "A".
He also
should have received everything else that he deserved, up to
and
including jail time. You said he should be held responsible
for his
natural consequences. (at least that's what I think I read
you as saying).
I have no problem with performance art if the artist is
willing to pay
the consequences. To expect to be excused from those
consequences in
the name of "art" I think is stupid though. Heck, the
terrorist's that
brought down the Towers were just expressing themselves (and
for
something a lot more substantial than "art"). My son when he
was young
threw a bowling ball out the window of a moving car (to see
what it
would do). Fortunately he didn''t hurt anyone nor cause
property
damage, but other people have done equally stupid things
with varying
results up to and including killing people. Where do we
draw the line?
Sincerely,
Earl
Vince Pitelka wrote:
>
> This artist perhaps showed too much youthful hubris and a
shortage of common
> sense, but otherwise I say he deserves credit for a gutsy
installation that
> pointed out the severely flawed security at this location.
He deserved that
> "A."
> Best wishes -
> - Vince
>
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Earl Brunner on sat 28 dec 02
Earls post...
Well, lets see Phil, I believe the area was evacuated, travel was
disrupted possibly (it was a terminal after all), extra police were
probably brought in, businesses in the area including artists and
potters at a close proximity sale were affected.... Financial hurt in
an area that hasn't recovered from 9-11 is and can be serious.
What was the harm? Gee, I don't know..........
Is the "artist" (and I use the term loosely) going to compensate for
these losses and expenses? He should have to.
The "over-reaction" of the authorities is NOT an over-reaction. It is
one of the natural outcomes of this "performance" art and he is
responsible for it and should pay for it. You can't pick and choose the
responses that are valid or not. Just because it WASN'T a real bomb
means the authorities OVERREACTED? They are still trying to blame
someone (authorities who apparently under reacted) in this country for
letting 9-11 happen.
Geez Phil.....
Earl
Philip Poburka wrote:
> Dear Earl, or anyone...
>
> Please tell me what the 'damages' were as the artist caused?
>
> What was the actual harm?
>
> My recollection is that no mention was ever made of anyone
> having any problem with it in any way, the 'boxes' were
> taped to a peripheral wall, and were not in anyone's way.
>
> I gathered that the authorities over-reacted.
>
> No mention as from the actual event said anything about
> anyone being freightened, upset or inconvenienced in any
> way.
>
> The only inconvenience mentioned stemmed frrom the
> over-reaction of the 'authorities'.
>
> There were other no problems of any kind that I heard of.
>
> Tell me Earl, What is it he should be 'Jailed' for?
>
> What was the 'harm'?
>
> Thanks...
>
> Phil
> Las Vegas
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Earl Brunner"
> To:
> Sent: Saturday, December 28, 2002 11:31 AM
> Subject: Re: youthful arrogance/ black boxes/special
> treatment for artists
>
>
> I've been thinking (there's a shocker) and I think that if
> he fulfilled
> the requirements for an "A" he should have received an "A".
> He also
> should have received everything else that he deserved, up to
> and
> including jail time. You said he should be held responsible
> for his
> natural consequences. (at least that's what I think I read
> you as saying).
> I have no problem with performance art if the artist is
> willing to pay
> the consequences. To expect to be excused from those
> consequences in
> the name of "art" I think is stupid though. Heck, the
> terrorist's that
> brought down the Towers were just expressing themselves (and
> for
> something a lot more substantial than "art"). My son when he
> was young
> threw a bowling ball out the window of a moving car (to see
> what it
> would do). Fortunately he didn''t hurt anyone nor cause
> property
> damage, but other people have done equally stupid things
> with varying
> results up to and including killing people. Where do we
> draw the line?
> Sincerely,
> Earl
>
>
> Vince Pitelka wrote:
>
>
>>This artist perhaps showed too much youthful hubris and a
>
> shortage of common
>
>>sense, but otherwise I say he deserves credit for a gutsy
>
> installation that
>
>>pointed out the severely flawed security at this location.
>
> He deserved that
>
>>"A."
>>Best wishes -
>>- Vince
>>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> __________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your
> subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
>
Earl Brunner on sun 29 dec 02
Earls post...
Civil and political "disobedience" can and does bring change in our
society, some good and some not so good. I would never suggest that a
person in our society not have the right to do so. Our history is full
of examples. Many people working for social change have done so, people
who worked in women's suffrage, civil rights, and anti-war movements
would be examples.
I simply stated that when they do so, they should be prepared to pay the
consequences of their actions. People die sometimes from acts of civil
disobedience, sometimes innocent bystanders. To suggest that someone
should not be held accountable is just wrong.
Are you suggesting that THIS case fits the criteria of "Sometimes
artists and activists have to raise hell and shake things up, and thank god
they do, because we really need it."? Because if you are, I'd like to
know how.
Sincerely,
Earl
Vince Pitelka wrote:
>>Well, lets see Phil, I believe the area was evacuated, travel was
>>disrupted possibly (it was a terminal after all), extra police were
>>probably brought in, businesses in the area including artists and
>>potters at a close proximity sale were affected.
>
>
> Yes, Earl, and when you are talking about art and/or political disobedience
> that honestly addresses societal ills and issues of social and political
> injustice, the above are NOTHING, of NO CONSEQUENCE WHATSOEVER. Sometimes
> artists and activists have to raise hell and shake things up, and thank god
> they do, because we really need it.
> - Vince
>
> Vince Pitelka
> Appalachian Center for Crafts
> Tennessee Technological University
> 1560 Craft Center Drive, Smithville TN 37166
> Home - vpitelka@dtccom.net
> 615/597-5376
> Work - wpitelka@tntech.edu
> 615/597-6801 ext. 111, fax 615/597-6803
> http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka/
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
>
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