John Rodgers on fri 7 mar 03
Hi Eleanora!!
Lets hear a BIG ONE for the slip casters!!!
I've been a slip caster for years. I'm also like you - it seems at times
non-slip casters don't have a clue!!!!
I throw clay, I slip cast clay. I do my own work in both cases. I like
what I do. It sells. Everything I have ever made has sold, slip cast or
not. Slip casting has been the biggest part of my career. If you design
and sculpt your own models, make your own molds, cast your own stuff,
fire it and finish it.....Stand up and be proud. You have earned the
right!!! Maybe a slip casters calendar would be in order to overcome the
narrow view!!
There is one hellava lot more work to get from design to finished work
in slip casting than in squishing a bit of clay between you fingers on a
wheel. I know. Like I said.... I do both. Most non-slipcasters get hung
up on the idea of "pottery", but slip casting covers vast fields of
endeavor. Slipcase hollow ware and flatware is only a very small part of
the slip casting world. Quite frankly, I feel that non-slipcasters
"can't get there from here" in many cases. There are pieces that simply
can't be done any other way. There are many designs that never would
have seen the light of day had they not been molded, then cast to
express the form. One thing about slip casting. You can do all your own
work, from design to finished medium, and there are many artists that
can't do that. They have to send their designs to a foundry. You, on the
other hand, can be proud of displaying your work and saying unabashedly
,"This work is mine, ALL mine!!"
If you haven't discovered him, look up Edward Marshal Boehm of Trenton,
NJ. ( now deceased) and read about him. His work was all slip cast
porcelain, and there were literally hundreds of parts in his castings,
all of which had to be assembled, cleaned, chased, and fired without
cracking, then china painted and/or stained, and fired multiple times.
His molds weighed up to 6000 lbs for each design that he created. His
piece titled "Sugarbirds" had a mold set that weighed 6500 lbs. His work
has sold in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, even when he was
alive. And even today his piece "Three Ivorybilled Woodpeckers" is worth
$150,000, even damaged. When Nixon went to China, he selected as a gift
from America to the People of China, Boehms "Pair of Mute Swans". It
made a spectacular hit with the Chinese. What could have been better
than to give porcelain swans to China, the origin of porcelain in the
first place. The value of the piece was between $150,000 and $200,000,
but there aren't enough dollars to measure the kudos Nixon got from the
Chinese for the gift. it was a coup on another level.
I myself have porcelain pieces from my own studio that have their home
in the Governors Office in the City of Akita, Akita Prefecture, on the
island of Ogatamura, Japan. These slipcast porcelain pieces were
selected as a gifts because the Governor there was fascinated by the
Eskimo people of Alaska and had made a study of their history. The
Governor there was thrilled to receive such gifts with the expression
of something of the Eskimo culture, in slip cast porcelain, with which
the Japanese have a long history.
To show some of this, I'm working on my web site and it should be up
shortly, and once it is up you will see some slip casting, I promise!
Long live the Slip Casters!!
John Rodgers
Birmingham, AL
Eleanora Eden wrote:
> Just happened on the 2004 calendar request for submissions. It amazed me
> to see that cast work is excluded. I'm tired to making the arguments and
> won't do it here. Maybe its cause the present political situation is so
> grim that I am especially saddened by the certainty many clayarters
> seem to
> have about categories of art. Walls, walls, walls.
>
> Eleanora
>
> Eleanora Eden 802 869-2003
> Paradise Hill Road eeden@vermontel.net
> Bellows Falls, VT 05101 www.eleanoraeden.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
>
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
Eleanora Eden on fri 7 mar 03
Just happened on the 2004 calendar request for submissions. It amazed me
to see that cast work is excluded. I'm tired to making the arguments and
won't do it here. Maybe its cause the present political situation is so
grim that I am especially saddened by the certainty many clayarters seem to
have about categories of art. Walls, walls, walls.
Eleanora
Eleanora Eden 802 869-2003
Paradise Hill Road eeden@vermontel.net
Bellows Falls, VT 05101 www.eleanoraeden.com
Valice Raffi on sat 8 mar 03
The Valley Sculpture Arts (in the Sacramento, CA area) uses the phrase " I
certify that this work was done in the last 3 years and is not a copy, and
if from a mold, the mold was hand made by the artist" on it's prospectus
(prospectusees, prospectusii?).
Maybe Lisa would consider a similar phrase for the calendar.
Valice
in Sacramento
John Rodgers on sat 8 mar 03
John Rodgers wrote:
>
> Lets hear a BIG ONE for the slip casters!!!
>
> I've been a slip caster for years. I'm also like you - it seems at times
> non-slip casters don't have a clue!!!!
>
> Long live the Slip Casters!!
Sorry for that RANT MODE folks!
It's just that I have gotten that crap all of my career and Eleanora's
comments really struck a nerve for the defense!! Nothing held against
anyone in patricular. We, as clayarters, and our opinions, are as
varied as leaves on trees, and ultimately whom ever is throwing the
party has the right to set the rules.
John Rodgers
Birmingham, AL
Miriam Shelomith on sat 8 mar 03
Here is a BIG ONE for slip casters!
Have had only one opportunity to see what goes on in a studio making slip
casting. Seeing the whole process of mold making, pouring of slip, cleaning
greenware, and decorating was impressive.
Would think that all ways of working with clay would be included in a
clayart calendar.
miriam
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]On Behalf Of John Rodgers
Sent: 07 March, 2003 9:46 PM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: no castings need apply
Hi Eleanora!!
Lets hear a BIG ONE for the slip casters!!!
I've been a slip caster for years. I'm also like you - it seems at times
non-slip casters don't have a clue!!!!
I throw clay, I slip cast clay. I do my own work in both cases. I like
what I do. It sells. Everything I have ever made has sold, slip cast or
not. Slip casting has been the biggest part of my career. If you design
and sculpt your own models, make your own molds, cast your own stuff,
fire it and finish it.....Stand up and be proud. You have earned the
right!!! Maybe a slip casters calendar would be in order to overcome the
narrow view!!
There is one hellava lot more work to get from design to finished work
in slip casting than in squishing a bit of clay between you fingers on a
wheel. I know. Like I said.... I do both. Most non-slipcasters get hung
up on the idea of "pottery", but slip casting covers vast fields of
endeavor. Slipcase hollow ware and flatware is only a very small part of
the slip casting world. Quite frankly, I feel that non-slipcasters
"can't get there from here" in many cases. There are pieces that simply
can't be done any other way. There are many designs that never would
have seen the light of day had they not been molded, then cast to
express the form. One thing about slip casting. You can do all your own
work, from design to finished medium, and there are many artists that
can't do that. They have to send their designs to a foundry. You, on the
other hand, can be proud of displaying your work and saying unabashedly
,"This work is mine, ALL mine!!"
If you haven't discovered him, look up Edward Marshal Boehm of Trenton,
NJ. ( now deceased) and read about him. His work was all slip cast
porcelain, and there were literally hundreds of parts in his castings,
all of which had to be assembled, cleaned, chased, and fired without
cracking, then china painted and/or stained, and fired multiple times.
His molds weighed up to 6000 lbs for each design that he created. His
piece titled "Sugarbirds" had a mold set that weighed 6500 lbs. His work
has sold in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, even when he was
alive. And even today his piece "Three Ivorybilled Woodpeckers" is worth
$150,000, even damaged. When Nixon went to China, he selected as a gift
from America to the People of China, Boehms "Pair of Mute Swans". It
made a spectacular hit with the Chinese. What could have been better
than to give porcelain swans to China, the origin of porcelain in the
first place. The value of the piece was between $150,000 and $200,000,
but there aren't enough dollars to measure the kudos Nixon got from the
Chinese for the gift. it was a coup on another level.
I myself have porcelain pieces from my own studio that have their home
in the Governors Office in the City of Akita, Akita Prefecture, on the
island of Ogatamura, Japan. These slipcast porcelain pieces were
selected as a gifts because the Governor there was fascinated by the
Eskimo people of Alaska and had made a study of their history. The
Governor there was thrilled to receive such gifts with the expression
of something of the Eskimo culture, in slip cast porcelain, with which
the Japanese have a long history.
To show some of this, I'm working on my web site and it should be up
shortly, and once it is up you will see some slip casting, I promise!
Long live the Slip Casters!!
John Rodgers
Birmingham, AL
Eleanora Eden wrote:
> Just happened on the 2004 calendar request for submissions. It amazed me
> to see that cast work is excluded. I'm tired to making the arguments and
> won't do it here. Maybe its cause the present political situation is so
> grim that I am especially saddened by the certainty many clayarters
> seem to
> have about categories of art. Walls, walls, walls.
>
> Eleanora
>
> Eleanora Eden 802 869-2003
> Paradise Hill Road eeden@vermontel.net
> Bellows Falls, VT 05101 www.eleanoraeden.com
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
>
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Eleanora Eden on wed 2 apr 03
Hi Miriam,
Just catching up on my clayart (NCECA and other travels) and saw your
post. Now I am on my annual mold-making time and I feel like making a new
mold is an accomplishment that outstrips throwing pots by alot.
Eleanora
At 11:28 AM 3/8/2003 -0500, you wrote:
>Here is a BIG ONE for slip casters!
>
>Have had only one opportunity to see what goes on in a studio making slip
>casting. Seeing the whole process of mold making, pouring of slip, cleaning
>greenware, and decorating was impressive.
>
>Would think that all ways of working with clay would be included in a
>clayart calendar.
>
>miriam
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]On Behalf Of John Rodgers
>Sent: 07 March, 2003 9:46 PM
>To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
>Subject: Re: no castings need apply
>
>
>Hi Eleanora!!
>
>Lets hear a BIG ONE for the slip casters!!!
>
>I've been a slip caster for years. I'm also like you - it seems at times
>non-slip casters don't have a clue!!!!
>
>I throw clay, I slip cast clay. I do my own work in both cases. I like
>what I do. It sells. Everything I have ever made has sold, slip cast or
>not. Slip casting has been the biggest part of my career. If you design
>and sculpt your own models, make your own molds, cast your own stuff,
>fire it and finish it.....Stand up and be proud. You have earned the
>right!!! Maybe a slip casters calendar would be in order to overcome the
>narrow view!!
>
>There is one hellava lot more work to get from design to finished work
>in slip casting than in squishing a bit of clay between you fingers on a
>wheel. I know. Like I said.... I do both. Most non-slipcasters get hung
>up on the idea of "pottery", but slip casting covers vast fields of
>endeavor. Slipcase hollow ware and flatware is only a very small part of
>the slip casting world. Quite frankly, I feel that non-slipcasters
>"can't get there from here" in many cases. There are pieces that simply
>can't be done any other way. There are many designs that never would
>have seen the light of day had they not been molded, then cast to
>express the form. One thing about slip casting. You can do all your own
>work, from design to finished medium, and there are many artists that
>can't do that. They have to send their designs to a foundry. You, on the
>other hand, can be proud of displaying your work and saying unabashedly
>,"This work is mine, ALL mine!!"
>
>If you haven't discovered him, look up Edward Marshal Boehm of Trenton,
>NJ. ( now deceased) and read about him. His work was all slip cast
>porcelain, and there were literally hundreds of parts in his castings,
>all of which had to be assembled, cleaned, chased, and fired without
>cracking, then china painted and/or stained, and fired multiple times.
>His molds weighed up to 6000 lbs for each design that he created. His
>piece titled "Sugarbirds" had a mold set that weighed 6500 lbs. His work
>has sold in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, even when he was
>alive. And even today his piece "Three Ivorybilled Woodpeckers" is worth
>$150,000, even damaged. When Nixon went to China, he selected as a gift
>from America to the People of China, Boehms "Pair of Mute Swans". It
>made a spectacular hit with the Chinese. What could have been better
>than to give porcelain swans to China, the origin of porcelain in the
>first place. The value of the piece was between $150,000 and $200,000,
>but there aren't enough dollars to measure the kudos Nixon got from the
>Chinese for the gift. it was a coup on another level.
>
>I myself have porcelain pieces from my own studio that have their home
>in the Governors Office in the City of Akita, Akita Prefecture, on the
>island of Ogatamura, Japan. These slipcast porcelain pieces were
>selected as a gifts because the Governor there was fascinated by the
>Eskimo people of Alaska and had made a study of their history. The
>Governor there was thrilled to receive such gifts with the expression
>of something of the Eskimo culture, in slip cast porcelain, with which
>the Japanese have a long history.
>
>To show some of this, I'm working on my web site and it should be up
>shortly, and once it is up you will see some slip casting, I promise!
>
>Long live the Slip Casters!!
>
>John Rodgers
>Birmingham, AL
>
>Eleanora Eden wrote:
>
> > Just happened on the 2004 calendar request for submissions. It amazed me
> > to see that cast work is excluded. I'm tired to making the arguments and
> > won't do it here. Maybe its cause the present political situation is so
> > grim that I am especially saddened by the certainty many clayarters
> > seem to
> > have about categories of art. Walls, walls, walls.
> >
> > Eleanora
> >
> > Eleanora Eden 802 869-2003
> > Paradise Hill Road eeden@vermontel.net
> > Bellows Falls, VT 05101 www.eleanoraeden.com
> >
> >
>____________________________________________________________________________
>__
> >
> > Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
> >
> > You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> > settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
> >
> > Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> > melpots@pclink.com.
> >
>
>____________________________________________________________________________
>__
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>melpots@pclink.com.
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>melpots@pclink.com.
Eleanora Eden 802 869-2003
Paradise Hill Road eeden@vermontel.net
Bellows Falls, VT 05101 www.eleanoraeden.com
Eleanora Eden on wed 2 apr 03
Hi John,
Well, your endeavors outstrip mine by a long howdy do. I appreciate that
you stuck your oar in. All the stuff you mention ought to be
self-evident. People are forever knocking other people down to make
themselves look better.....
Anyway, I am in the midst of my annual mold-making splurge and I gotta say
it makes me feel more like I really and truly accomplished something than
wheel work ever does. Power to the mold-makers!
Eleanora
At 08:46 PM 3/7/2003 -0600, you wrote:
>Hi Eleanora!!
>
>Lets hear a BIG ONE for the slip casters!!!
>
>I've been a slip caster for years. I'm also like you - it seems at times
>non-slip casters don't have a clue!!!!
>
>I throw clay, I slip cast clay. I do my own work in both cases. I like
>what I do. It sells. Everything I have ever made has sold, slip cast or
>not. Slip casting has been the biggest part of my career. If you design
>and sculpt your own models, make your own molds, cast your own stuff,
>fire it and finish it.....Stand up and be proud. You have earned the
>right!!! Maybe a slip casters calendar would be in order to overcome the
>narrow view!!
>
>There is one hellava lot more work to get from design to finished work
>in slip casting than in squishing a bit of clay between you fingers on a
>wheel. I know. Like I said.... I do both. Most non-slipcasters get hung
>up on the idea of "pottery", but slip casting covers vast fields of
>endeavor. Slipcase hollow ware and flatware is only a very small part of
>the slip casting world. Quite frankly, I feel that non-slipcasters
>"can't get there from here" in many cases. There are pieces that simply
>can't be done any other way. There are many designs that never would
>have seen the light of day had they not been molded, then cast to
>express the form. One thing about slip casting. You can do all your own
>work, from design to finished medium, and there are many artists that
>can't do that. They have to send their designs to a foundry. You, on the
>other hand, can be proud of displaying your work and saying unabashedly
>,"This work is mine, ALL mine!!"
>
>If you haven't discovered him, look up Edward Marshal Boehm of Trenton,
>NJ. ( now deceased) and read about him. His work was all slip cast
>porcelain, and there were literally hundreds of parts in his castings,
>all of which had to be assembled, cleaned, chased, and fired without
>cracking, then china painted and/or stained, and fired multiple times.
>His molds weighed up to 6000 lbs for each design that he created. His
>piece titled "Sugarbirds" had a mold set that weighed 6500 lbs. His work
>has sold in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, even when he was
>alive. And even today his piece "Three Ivorybilled Woodpeckers" is worth
>$150,000, even damaged. When Nixon went to China, he selected as a gift
>from America to the People of China, Boehms "Pair of Mute Swans". It
>made a spectacular hit with the Chinese. What could have been better
>than to give porcelain swans to China, the origin of porcelain in the
>first place. The value of the piece was between $150,000 and $200,000,
>but there aren't enough dollars to measure the kudos Nixon got from the
>Chinese for the gift. it was a coup on another level.
>
>I myself have porcelain pieces from my own studio that have their home
>in the Governors Office in the City of Akita, Akita Prefecture, on the
>island of Ogatamura, Japan. These slipcast porcelain pieces were
>selected as a gifts because the Governor there was fascinated by the
>Eskimo people of Alaska and had made a study of their history. The
>Governor there was thrilled to receive such gifts with the expression
>of something of the Eskimo culture, in slip cast porcelain, with which
>the Japanese have a long history.
>
>To show some of this, I'm working on my web site and it should be up
>shortly, and once it is up you will see some slip casting, I promise!
>
>Long live the Slip Casters!!
>
>John Rodgers
>Birmingham, AL
>
>Eleanora Eden wrote:
>
>>Just happened on the 2004 calendar request for submissions. It amazed me
>>to see that cast work is excluded. I'm tired to making the arguments and
>>won't do it here. Maybe its cause the present political situation is so
>>grim that I am especially saddened by the certainty many clayarters
>>seem to
>>have about categories of art. Walls, walls, walls.
>>
>>Eleanora
>>
>>Eleanora Eden 802 869-2003
>>Paradise Hill Road eeden@vermontel.net
>>Bellows Falls, VT 05101 www.eleanoraeden.com
>>
>>______________________________________________________________________________
>>
>>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>>
>>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>>
>>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>>melpots@pclink.com.
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>melpots@pclink.com.
Eleanora Eden 802 869-2003
Paradise Hill Road eeden@vermontel.net
Bellows Falls, VT 05101 www.eleanoraeden.com
Susan Setley on wed 2 apr 03
In a message dated 4/2/03 9:20:42 AM, eeden@VERMONTEL.NET writes:
<< Hi Miriam,
Just catching up on my clayart (NCECA and other travels) and saw your
post. Now I am on my annual mold-making time and I feel like making a new
mold is an accomplishment that outstrips throwing pots by alot.
Eleanora
>>
I know an artist who uses molds to produce tremendously artistic pieces that
are still, each, one of a kind. The mols is the start, not the finish.
However, sh ewould never say that her mold making is superior to what her
wheel-throwing colleagues do. In fact, two of them often collaborate and hold
each other's skills in high esteem.
I hope we can all do the same. :)
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