c y on wed 12 nov 03
hi, i've just started using water slide ceramic decals and experienced noxious odors when i fired my first 018 kiln. i was wondering if this is normal and if not, has anyone else experienced it? what can i do to solve this problem? thanks, caroline
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John Rodgers on thu 13 nov 03
This is normal. The backing that is the carrier for the colorants that
are left on the surface of the ware burns out leaving the colors. I
forget what that material is but it is like a plastic. The design is
typically silkscreened onto the backing, which is, as you know, mounted
on a paper backing from which the decal is removed after soaking
The clear backing does smell when burning out. The bad smell will
dissipate but having a fan to circulate the air and create an air
exchange is a good idea. Breathing those fumes is not a good thing in
any case.
Regards,
John Rodgers
Chelsea, AL
c y wrote:
>hi, i've just started using water slide ceramic decals and experienced noxious odors when i fired my first 018 kiln. i was wondering if this is normal and if not, has anyone else experienced it? what can i do to solve this problem? thanks, caroline
>
>
>
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Jim Tabor on thu 13 nov 03
c y wrote:
>hi, i've just started using water slide ceramic decals and experienced noxious odors when i fired my first 018 kiln. i was wondering if this is normal and if not, has anyone else experienced it? what can i do to solve this problem? thanks, caroline
>
The only solution I know is to stay away from the area until the burn
off is complete and vapors are gone. Ventilation is important and
helpful but you will probably need to plan firings when you can be away
a few hours while the smoke clears if you fire many decals at a time.
Even direct printing without covercoat will produce vapors to avoid but
not as extreme.
Jim Tabor
>
>
>
Janet Kaiser on fri 14 nov 03
I feel like picking a little nit! Better first find something out
though... Is the word "noxious" used to simply mean "unpleasant"
in Trans-Atlantic Potters' Parlance? I only ask because I have
fallen faul of TAPP before!
Anyway... Here in the UK, "noxious" means harmful or dangerous. I
cannot believe that decals are now manufactured which would be
truly harmful, however unpleasant they smell when firing off.
Certainly not decals produced in the USA where there appears a
propensity to sue suppliers for not declaring the active
ingredients or contents of products and/or give warnings about
appropriate/inappropriate use.
Wouldn't it be more sensible to ask the manufacturer, rather than
rely on heresay and listen to other people's opinion here? I do
not wish to appear harsh or in the least controversial, but as
RR, JH, Mel and others have often declared, one of the main
functions of Clayart is to disseminate truth and dispose of myth.
Having read a couple of the replies to the original question, I
do believe this could well be one of those areas/subjects which
would merit some closer scrutiny. Yes? No?
Sincerely
Janet Kaiser -- Trying very hard to match TC`s sublime PC... But
is difficult concentrating on a night when gusts of 100 mph have
been forecast and other dire warnings given. When the BBC /
Meteorological Office start telling us to stay home and keep off
the roads, it really is serious. They even mentioned Aberdaron
(just a little up the coast) and Llanbedr (just down the coast)
on the National Forecast, so it must be a trifle breezy... :o)
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Hollis Engley on fri 14 nov 03
From: Janet Kaiser
Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 7:40 AM
Subject: Re: help! noxious odors while firing water slide decals?
> I feel like picking a little nit! Better first find something out
> though... Is the word "noxious" used to simply mean "unpleasant"
> in Trans-Atlantic Potters' Parlance? I only ask because I have
> fallen faul of TAPP before!
>
> Anyway... Here in the UK, "noxious" means harmful or dangerous.
Hi, Janet. Around here, at least in my language, "noxious" has usually meant
"stinking" to the point of being disgusting or dangerous. But, as you've
discussed before, the same words can mean very different things to different
people. A piece on National Public Radio this week talked about the
difference in meanings of the phrase "on the up and up." I've gone through
my whole language life using that phrase to mean "legitimate" or "legal." I
was amazed to find that a large percentage of people use it to mean "getting
increasingly better." As in "Man U's season has been on the up and up since
it's early loss to Aberystwyth." Amazing.
Hollis
Hatchville Pottery
hengley@cape.com
Falmouth, Mass., where the gusting winds are keeping the ferry boats at the
dock and no one's getting home to Martha's Vineyard.
Lee Love on fri 14 nov 03
----- Original Message -----
From: "Janet Kaiser"
> RR, JH, Mel and others have often declared, one of the main
> functions of Clayart is to disseminate truth and dispose of myth.
Oh golly. You know what? Truth and myth are not contradictory. Much
of my "World View" has been strongly influenced by the work of Joseph
Campbell. (my "Big Picture" world view is directed by Campbell's work,
while I address the specifics from a Zen perspective.) Campbell explains
myth this way:
"No, myth is not a lie. A whole mythology is an organization of
symbolic images and narratives, metaphorical of the possibilities of human
experience and the fulfillment of a given culture at a given time."
Understanding metaphor is an ability, just like understanding
numbers is an ability or skill. With metaphor, you are dealing in the
realm of quality, while in the factual world, you are dealing with quantity.
If a quantitative approach seeks control, a qualitative approach seeks
understanding. One way believes that the human mind knows best, while the
other way believes that a part (the mind) can never contain the whole. It
can only be informed by the whole.
Some of us are gifted in one way of understanding while others
of us are gifted in another. Frankly, in modern times, we are loosing the
ability to understand metaphorical truth. Why? Because, it is easier
to control us if we don't understand.
You can read all of Campbell's essay at this link:
http://www.livejournal.com/users/togeika/2003/11/01/
--
Lee In Mashiko, Japan
http://Mashiko.org
Web Log (click on recent date):
http://www.livejournal.com/users/togeika/calendar
Snail Scott on fri 14 nov 03
At 12:40 PM 11/14/03 +0000, you wrote:
>...Is the word "noxious" used to simply mean "unpleasant"
>in Trans-Atlantic Potters' Parlance?
>Anyway... Here in the UK, "noxious" means harmful or dangerous.
In US colloquial usage, 'noxious' merely means
unpleasant. The dictionary definition is 'harmful
or dangerous', just as it is in Britain, but it's
almost never used that way in daily speech.
As to whether overglaze decal fumes are in fact
hazardous or merely icky, I don't know. Just in
case, though, I wouldn't sniff 'em.
-Snail
pdp1@EARTHLINK.NET on fri 14 nov 03
Hi Lee,
Wanna buy some Peruvian municipal 'Bridge' Bonds?
A good investment!
...ahem...
Old Joseph Campbell would be properly amused I think!
Phil
Las Vegas
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Love"
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Janet Kaiser"
>
> > RR, JH, Mel and others have often declared, one of the
main
> > functions of Clayart is to disseminate truth and dispose
of myth.
>
> Oh golly. You know what? Truth and myth are not
contradictory. Much
> of my "World View" has been strongly influenced by the
work of Joseph
> Campbell. (my "Big Picture" world view is directed by
Campbell's work,
> while I address the specifics from a Zen perspective.)
Campbell explains
> myth this way:
>
> "No, myth is not a lie. A whole mythology is an
organization of
> symbolic images and narratives, metaphorical of the
possibilities of human
> experience and the fulfillment of a given culture at a
given time."
>
> Understanding metaphor is an ability, just like
understanding
> numbers is an ability or skill. With metaphor, you are
dealing in the
> realm of quality, while in the factual world, you are
dealing with quantity.
> If a quantitative approach seeks control, a qualitative
approach seeks
> understanding. One way believes that the human mind knows
best, while the
> other way believes that a part (the mind) can never
contain the whole. It
> can only be informed by the whole.
>
> Some of us are gifted in one way of
understanding while others
> of us are gifted in another. Frankly, in modern times,
we are loosing the
> ability to understand metaphorical truth. Why?
Because, it is easier
> to control us if we don't understand.
>
> You can read all of Campbell's essay at this link:
>
> http://www.livejournal.com/users/togeika/2003/11/01/
>
> --
> Lee In Mashiko, Japan
> http://Mashiko.org
> Web Log (click on recent date):
> http://www.livejournal.com/users/togeika/calendar
>
>
____________________________________________________________
__________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your
subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
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> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached
at melpots@pclink.com.
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