Larry Kruzan on sat 15 nov 03
encourage more pollution!
It my be hard for anti-establishment throwbacks to the 60's to understand,
but it is tax moves like this that give our customers cash to spend on our
pots, bowls, and plates or even our "Art". If everybody had to drive a
aging Camry because they could do no better we would not sell a thing.
Spendable, disposable income is the lifeblood of all of us. In order for
there to be disposable income a customer must have income that exceeds their
basic necessities of life. When you pay 50% or more of your income to the
tax man every break matters. Before you say that you don't earn enough to
pay taxes I would remind you that you pay taxes on everything you buy, much
more than sales tax.
When you go to a car dealer and buy a new car you pay the whole cost of
social security on every worker that built your car. You pay the gas tax
that it cost to transport the parts to the assembler. If some of the car is
imported as parts you will be paying the import tariff as well as shipping
taxes. You pay a excise tax on the tires and on and on until you get to the
toothy grin of the "salesman of the week" whose income tax and social
security you are about to pay. I have no idea what the real percentage is
but I have hear that the total exceeds 40% of the cost of a new auto is tax
in one form or another.
But you say you only drive used cars? You eat don't you? That gallon of
milk your family drank today made the farmer about 35 cents. The
supermarket made 10% margin to keep the lights on and maybe a few percent of
profit. The rest of the cost came from transportation costs mostly related
to taxes. There is normally a middleman too, so you get the privilege of
paying his taxes too.
Near where I live there is a medium size trucking center that operates about
1000 trucks. Our foolish state government needed some extra money this year
so they passed an additional $1000 per truck tax on OTR truck in this state.
Result - the company is moving it's home base 150 miles out of state.
Saving a million dollars a year, that doesn't help the people who worked
for them in the unemployment line though.
Perhaps we need better economic education or maybe a dose of common sense -
I don't know which - but either way we better understand where our money
comes from and where it's going or we are going to wake up some day just
working to support the government. Gas here is $1.67 a gallon - taxes are
70 cents of that. Before you give me the good roads argument come drive
these Illinois roads.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Dunn Clark"
To:
Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2003 10:21 AM
Subject: Re: tax write off for your new vehicle? Thats' it.....lets
encourage more pollution!
Thankyou ever so much for getting my day off to a lousy start! I was
aware of this ill considered write off when it came into being. Indeed, I
screamed to the high heavens, for all the good it did (none.) This is all
the citizens of this, or any other, country need. An economic incentive to
go out and pollute more. I ,mean.......damn!!!!!
Rather than running to take advantage of this ozone busting, war
enhancing measure -we would not be involved in the Middle East if it
weren't for our insatiable thirst for oil and these vehicles guzzle gas-
it would be time better spent to contacting our representatives and pleading
for it's repeal.
What we need are incentives that encourage folks to conserve and turn to
more fuel efficient means of transport not less. This is kinda like the
story about the old roman emperor Nero who fiddled away as his city burned
around him. Just butt ugly ignorant.
I gave up my gas guzziling truck five years ago. Since then I've
discovered the wonders of delivery and how much easier it is to manuever a
small vehicle through the traffic. Took some getting used to. But it works.
I've also been forced to be more creative in the use of the limited
space an aging Camry provides. I never would have thought that I would be
able to fit a wheel, 200lbs of mud, 8 bats, a buncha tools, towels and
various implements of destruction into one along with my 6ft 2inch 220lb
carcass.......this makes me look askance at the folks who say they don't
have enough room in small cars. Foooeeeey!
Cursing in Texas
Where a village is missing it's idiot
Craig Dunn Clark
619 East 11 1/2 st
Houston, Texas 77008
(713)861-2083
mudman@hal-pc.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gail Phillips"
To:
Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 11:12 PM
Subject: tax write off for your new vehicle?
> Hi, all -
>
>
>
> A friend of mine read a bit of this to me today, and I immediately thought
> of how it might benefit Clayart people! Have a read -
>
>
>
>
>
> http://www.msnbc.com/modules/exports/ct_email.asp?/news/990356.asp
>
>
>
> for aol users -
>
> >
href>http://www.msnbc.com/modules/exports/ct_email.asp?/news/990356.asp
>
>
>
>
>
> - Gail Phillips, Praying Mantis Pottery
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
____________________________________________________________________________
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Steve Slatin on sun 16 nov 03
encourage more pollution!
Wayne --
The difference is you're using your vehicle to produce income. As a
business owner, you have probably used depreciation before, and may even
have been a user of the cents-per-mile convention, which is a truly
simple and generally reasonable approach, though its one-size-fits-all
approach makes it unsuitable for people who need vehicles with low gas
mileage, high insurance costs, or other issues. Using 179 expensing in
lieu of normal depreciation isn't itself the problem.
The problem comes with the legal presumption that anything with GVW over
6,000 lbs has to be for business, and not having to meet the usual tests
of business use. Did you ever use the cents-per-mile convention? If
you did, you noticed two things -- one, the IRS seems to make you go
through three times as much math as necessary to identify actual
business mileage, and two, you deduct only the proportionate business
use of the vehicle.
When people buy big vehicles for non-business purposes and deduct the
cost using various dodges mentioned elsewhere, they're not spending
money to make money and having the government encourage it (which is
what section 179 is supposed to be about). They're making money through
one means and buying a heavier vehicle than they need -- or maybe even
want -- because without the section 179-plus-6,000-lbs-GVW dodge, they
have no legitimate business use for the vehicle, but with it they can
write off the entire cost.
The reason why government regulations are intrusive is because of abuse.
The government can be counted on to react to this and to create a
specific solution once the public awareness of it becomes great enough.
It is likely that the solution the government comes to will be bulky,
intrusive, and create further serious inequities.
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of
wayneinkeywest
Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2003 5:16 PM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: tax write off for your new vehicle? Thats' it.....lets
encourage more pollution!
>Ok, here's one from the other side.
>Once every ten years or so I buy a
>new vehicle.
K & M Giles on sun 16 nov 03
encourage more pollution!
Don't bash that poor Yugo. Mine would hold me and 10 boxes of pots. I
still miss it; it died from lack of replacement parts. I could park it
anywhere, and no one would bother it, locked or unlocked. It got great gas
mileage, and cost less than 1/3 of the price of the mini-van that replaced
it. The engine was simple enough that I could open the hood and recognize
all the parts. I must admit, the Yugo engineers did not understand Texas
summers; the car would over heat if you used the a.c. when it was over 85!
Kristen Giles
>And what exactly do you drive to an art fair? Your Yugo?
>.
Steve Slatin on sun 16 nov 03
encourage more pollution!
Larry --
Whether you're a "throwback to the 60's" or an authentic conservative,
this particular tax write off is bogus.
It is a special consideration for purchasers of vehicles of 6000 lbs
weight
or more. It's INTENTION was to differentiate between vehicles for
personal
use and those so unwieldy that only a complete ignoramus would use it
for,
say, commuting. When written, nothing with reasonable creature comforts
weighed three tons. As it was originally written, it was not
susceptible of misuse because you had to carry the vehicle over a period
of years anyway, and be ready with records (if challenged) to show it
was a bona fide business purchase.
Now that the automakers have given us three-ton behemoths the sole
purpose
of which is to go to the corner for a quart of milk, abuse becomes a
ready
possibility. Since the Congress provided extended expensing (now
$100,000)
per year for business purchases, owners of a business can write off
these purchase amounts in the first year. After the first year, the
utilization of the vehicle isn't subject to challenge (because it's no
longer being depreciated).
There are folks selling cars to along with instructions on how to create
a shell company to make the actual purchase, write off the cost, etc.
They are showing people how to avoid paying taxes by hiding the income
within a company that does no business except to purchase the car.
If you buy a Ford Ranger to take your pots to a craft show, it doesn't
apply. If you buy a Hummer -- which among its other characteristics is
a very hard vehicle to load and unload, and consequently unsuitable for
almost all business functions -- you can write it off.
This is an irrational outcome that exists only because of the
super-sizing of non-commercial vehicles. The handful of people who can
and will take advantage of it aren't, IMHO, significant consumers of
hand-made pottery anyway. If you are interested in seeing more folks
have disposable income for an $18 plate, or a $50 platter, the solution
comes at the other end of the tax/income equation.
Regards -- Steve S
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Larry
Kruzan
Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2003 7:43 PM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: tax write off for your new vehicle? Thats' it.....lets
encourage more pollution!
>It my be hard for anti-establishment throwbacks to the 60's to
understand,
wayneinkeywest on sun 16 nov 03
encourage more pollution!
Ok, here's one from the other side.
Once every ten years or so I buy a
new vehicle. I have to, the old one
had about 250,000 miles on it, all
stop and go traffic, and it's pretty
much shot.
If I buy that new vehicle (for the
business) and take that $25,000
off the top of my income, gee,
let's see....
I not only get a vehicle which gets
better mileage than my old one
(14 miles per gallon for the Jeep
Grand Cherokee as opposed to
7 miles per gallon my Ranger pickup got)
I also get a vehicle that has more
carrying space _out_ of the weather.
I also get seating for four (as opposed
to two in the Ranger) which means I can carry
my crew with me and not have to worry about another
vehicle, parking, maintenance and the like.
I also get less frequent service intervals,
which means....I get to actually go to work
instead of waiting for the vehicle to be serviced,
which means re-scheduling clients and having my
whole week's schedule skewed.
On top of all that (as if that weren't enough!) I
get a tax break because of taking it off my
income means I'm paying less taxes.
Can you say DUH! I'm going to buy that new
vehicle (and did).
No apologies here. That tax write off is a
godsend for small businesses like mine.
Wayne Seidl
> Larry --
>
> Whether you're a "throwback to the 60's" or an authentic conservative,
> this particular tax write off is bogus.
>
Lee Love on mon 17 nov 03
encourage more pollution!
----- Original Message -----
From: "wayneinkeywest"
> I also get a vehicle that has more
> carrying space _out_ of the weather.
Here where I live in Japan, it snows so little I really wonder why
there are so many four wheel drive vehicles. Sometimes they get snow in
the mountains. Front wheel drive seems like it does the job and you are
required to use chains in the mountains if it snows.
I understand the need for four wheel drive in Minnesota.
The Cherokees here in Japan probably come from China. Chrysler
has a plant there.
--
Lee In Mashiko, Japan
Our gas guzzlers burn natural resources our great-grandchildren may need:
http://www.ariannaonline.com/suv/
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