mel jacobson on tue 23 dec 03
there is a logical, simple answer.
you must have both, all.
....you build a pottery, and that is
not just one tool.
it would be like buying a car without
the windshield and seats.
`i will get that later`.
a studio, a pottery, is a series of tools.
kiln, wheel, space, tables, lights.
hard to make pots when you have to
use someone else's kiln. and what if they
do not fire the way you want?
i always suggest to folks that want to start
working clay...go to an art center and use the
entire facility...and save your money, then,
when you want to open a studio, get all the
stuff you need. then add more, and more, and
more, just like the rest of us.
hell, i hate to move my pots 12 feet to the kiln...what
would it be like to drive them across town?
From:
Minnetonka, Minnesota, U.S.A.
web site: my.pclink.com/~melpots
or try: http://www.pclink.com/melpots
new/ http://www.rid-a-tick.com
wayneinkeywest on tue 23 dec 03
My first car was exactly that. '62 VW Beetle,
no windshield, no seats. "I'll buy them later".
Never did. Hell in the winter.
Did put in a seatbelt to hold the lawn chair
I sat in down while I drove. 1973, 18 years old, drove
that poor car into places no car should ever have
been asked to go. Usually got me out again.
Easy to push if it didn't. Never let me down.
Always started, even at 25 below zero.
Cost me $35.00. Gas was $3 a tank.
Thanks for reminding me Mel, that even
humble beginnings can be fond memories.
It's true with pots too.
Wayne Seidl
> it would be like buying a car without
> the windshield and seats.
> `i will get that later`.
>
Hendrix, Taylor J. on tue 23 dec 03
Melman...er...Melsan,
You don't have to imagine it, let me tell you.
It sucks. In Esperanto that's "blows." All failures are mysteries and
all success is suspect. How can a potter do just half the work and keep
her sanity? No way to.
Dig this: Get introduced to pottery by a friend who has been doing it
for 20 years, has a small home studio. Fall hard, become obsessed. Was
teaching so I didn't make squat. Had to build my own kick wheel because
I just couldn't keep going over to friend's house to throw. Stepping
all over each other in that one woman studio. Now I have a means of
throwing at home and the work picks up. Mucho crapo hits the reclaim
bucket, but mucho fills the shelves for glazing. Still no kiln. Had to
cart it to the next town for friend to bisque. No glazes at home. Had
to leave bisque at friend's small studio until she was going to glaze
fire. Used her glazes. Spent hours glazing for a 7 cu ft because I
knew nothing about her glazes. I still don't at it's been almost two
years. =20
So, my control ended when the pot left the wheel head. Not cool. Glaze
defects? What the hell? How to even begin to figure out what the
problem was? I had very little control of the process. I dipped,
trailed, brushed. I helped stack the kiln, but that was it. No say in
the firing, no understanding of the glazes. I was running blind. Not a
problem when all was new, everything was discovery. Now I wish to exert
some control and I can't. I'm still not in control of half the process.
I say do what you have to for the tools to complete your pots, turning
to burning, whatever it takes. Cold call catastrophic life insurance
door to door if you have to, but get control of your pots. No money?
Make what you can. Go junking and find the rest. I count myself so
lucky to have a kiln now. I count the days till I get it operational.
Then and only then can I hope to begin to master my pots. I know that I
have a lot of failure (learning) in the future, but that's all gravy,
baby. All that will be reinvested in me. Every pot will educate me. I
mix the glaze, I set the cone packs, I flipped the switches, I pull the
pots. Until then, I am still just playing.
Taylor, in Waco
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of mel
jacobson
Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2003 5:14 AM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: wheel or kiln?
...
you must have both, all.
...
hell, i hate to move my pots 12 feet to the kiln...what
would it be like to drive them across town?
...
Christy Pines on tue 23 dec 03
I know what it's like to move my pots across town - actually 30 miles down the road to a different town, and 2 hours up the road to still a different town - to get them fired. Not fun. Been doing it for a year. Only broke 2 in all that time, but still, the worry and the packaging materials alone....
And the first thing I bought was a wheel - cheaper than a kiln (I thought) and immediately accessible. No special wiring, knowledge etc.
HOWEVER, thinking on it now, if I"d had a kiln, I might have pushed myself to do more handbuilt stuff, which I really like the look of, like to create, think is very very cool when I see what others have done, have a tendency to buy.
But I don't do it that much - cause I have the wheel. If there were only a kiln, who knows what directions my art might have taken. And still might, of course.
christy in connecticut, back from the 2 hour trek to Dew Claw in Providence, RI where they had their studio sale, and where I just love to hang out with Kris and John, and a detour to the Guilford Handcrafts Center holiday sale where some amazing pots were available, finally back in my own little house with (thrown) greenware all over the place waiting to go to a kiln somewhere.
-----Original Message-----
From: mel jacobson
hell, i hate to move my pots 12 feet to the kiln...what
would it be like to drive them across town?
Odin Maxwell on wed 24 dec 03
On Tue, 23 Dec 2003 05:14:29 -0600, mel jacobson wrote:
>there is a logical, simple answer.
>
>you must have both, all.
>....you build a pottery, and that is
>not just one tool.
Agreed, but let's say you can have only one thing at a time and a community
studio is not an option - I've lived lots of places where it isn't. I would
get/put together a kiln first. You can always handbuild and fire that
pottery. If you get a wheel first, you will have an awful lot of bone dry
pottery ... not quite the most durable stuff.
I think it is easy to put off dreams until the entire situation is perfect -
50 acres with detached building for a studio and all the doodads imaginable.
I believe there is reasonable case to be made for taking a dream that is
presently out of reach, and modifying it's scope such that it changes from
"dream" to a reasonable "plan". Plans are far better than dreams because
you can go do them ... now.
I've been so hard up to fire before that I've fired stuff in a small saggar
in a Webber grill. It actually resulted in some neat stuff. I've fired in
wood stoves and fireplaces. I built a raku kiln - learned how to weld
(amateurishly). I made a tubular updraft kiln out of cardboard concrete
forms and castable refractory. Fired to Cone 10 with two weed burners and
two 30lb propane tanks (could have gotten by with only one - I couldn't turn
them up past 1/4 turn). Or a tiny woodkiln fired with charcoal, kindling,
and a shopvac on exhaust. Finally, I live in town, but I've always wanted
an anagama. So I leased some space from a farmer in an unused field and
built an anagama. I can lease that for the next 60 years in comparrison to
what it would cost to buy five acres (sans access, water, or electricity).
In all probability - I won't live that long.
>hell, i hate to move my pots 12 feet to the kiln...what
>would it be like to drive them across town?
Addmitedly, driving pottery ten miles out to the kiln site is a pain. I've
been thinking of walling in my wood storage area and puting in a kick wheel.
We'll see - that would mean wood under blue tarps again and by gosh, I've
seen enough blue tarps since starting this project to feel like a smurf.
Anyone need a blue tarp yurt? I got tarps coming out my ears!
Anyway, my point: why wait? Do you forgo having a car because a BMW is too
expensive? Unlikely, you get that '76 Corrola wagon, yellow with one brown
door. If your dream isn't reachable in the foreseable future, change it so
that it is.
om
shameless self promotion, if you'd like to see my kiln:
http://www.anagama-west.com
Lee Love on wed 24 dec 03
I would try to do both or neither. I think Mel mentioned going to a
clay center. It is a great way to start until you can afford both.
You don't have to drop a couple grand for a kiln. You can make a
woodkiln out of a couple wheelbarrows full of old brick and a couple
shelves. I have one in the back yard I slapped together to bisque work
to put in my teacher's noborigama. Hits red heat in an hour (blew the pots
up the first two times I fired it.) Finially learned to start it slow by
building a fire out side the kiln in the begining. Doesn't make any more
smoke than a barbeque. I want to rebuilt it to bisque in and experment
with yohen firing, introducing charcoal at the end of the firing.
--
Lee In Mashiko, Japan Lee@Mashiko.org
http://mashiko.org
http://mashiko.us
lili krakowski on wed 24 dec 03
Have been holding my breath here. Why not build your own wheel? A =
kickwheel can be built for very little--Charles Counts has a very clear =
desciption in his book, as does Andrew Holden. Both books should be =
obtainable from your library. An electric hweel can be home built as =
well--Ceramics Monthly had a clear piece about that some years ago. As =
I recall the wheel (then) would have cost $75. =20
You CAN have it all--
Lili
Anne Wellings on thu 25 dec 03
On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 23:49:10 +0900, Lee Love wrote:
> I would try to do both or neither. I think Mel mentioned going to a
>clay center. It is a great way to start until you can afford both.
>
Clay centers are a great resource and the only option for some to have
access to a full studio. But if one is using a clay center, it can be very
helpful to also have a wheel (or slab-roller, etc.) to set up wherever one
can eke out a space at home. I set up a wheel and shelves in a small
laundry area of a studio apartment. (Any kind of kiln was out of the
question there, and moving was not an option at the time.) I could still
use the wheels at the clay center but could also throw at 3:00 in the
morning if I wanted to. I got in a lot more needed practice time, without
distractions, and felt more confident that someday I could have my own real
studio. Transporting the greenware was not that big of a deal, though I
knew I didn't want to do it forever.
If there is no clay center available, then yes, you need some way to fire
the clay before you need any other piece of equipment. But to deny myself
that used Model B Brent wheel just because I couldn't set up my own kiln
at the time would have been counter-productive. I'm still throwing on that
wheel almost 20 years later, and yes, I do have a kiln now.
Anne
iandol on thu 25 dec 03
Dear Friends,
We all have to make choices and the range of choices we are offered =
depends on our personal circumstances, the nature of the environment and =
the resources of the locality where we live. Choices are also determined =
by Ambitions and Goals. Each person can make an informed decision. If =
you have to make an "either/or' choice when advancing to a goal do a =
SWOT analysis for your own situation, list your resources and put a plan =
together.
It could be that you are in a situation where you could implement Mel's =
recipe for success and buy "the whole car" or you could go for the daily =
rental option. But I have met people who have bought cars, boats and =
planes piece by piece and had very successful results. Takes time, is =
done within the restrictions of available resources, brings a great deal =
of pleasure and is a successful alternative.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis. Redhill, South Australia
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