Jan L. Peterson on sat 27 dec 03
Archeologists of the future...
Phil: I have to disagree. But then, I was an Anthropologist student.
Difference, I'm sure. I think there are a lot of things they can figure out. After
all, the obviously figured out the Roman's early home heating system, and that
was rather sophisticated. I have heard of several sophisticated things we
haven't been able to emulate of figure out how they work. Where is Edison when you
really need him? He would have made an excellent Anthropologist.
I did some rudimentary digging on my own up here. Find a lot of unusual
artifacts in an old two-holer.
I can't imagine how a person could miss the function of a toilet, unless they
are so evolved by then, they don't go. I can't think of any way to improve
the seating arrangement of the contraption, myself, and would certainly veto
anything that forced me to carry the waste products around personally.
History is studied along with Archaeology, even what they call pre-history.
Too bad that the thirteenth century didn't know you don't camp on your own dead
and wastes. Maybe Henry IV would have survived longer. Maybe his men could
have won Agincourt, and come home.
We will get back to educating people, have faith. And, if some of our books
survive, then there will be clues. Like Bathroom Humor, and You Know You're a
Redneck When...Jan, the Alleycat.
pdp1@EARTHLINK.NET on sat 27 dec 03
Archeologists of the future...
Hi John, Lee, All,
I myself do not forsee any significant likelyhood of there
being intelligent
'Archeologists' in the future...less so, that they should
have any interest in the dizzying abundance and variety of
our
artifacts, or sympathy for or with them if they were
examining them.
Unless, as in the old film 'Road Warrior', there is a market
for Metallic Cartridges, Shot Gun Shells, or Cans of
Gasolene...or maybe ampules of Morphine or the like as would
be good keepers over time...
The majority of practicinig Archeologists presently, however
interested they may appear to be, when exumeing Artifacts of
even a hundred or a few hunderd years internment, are quite
confused and clueless about many of those artifacts,
fragments or abstracts, being they are not familiar with
things of those times, and prefer to transfer interpolations
from the paucity of contemporary things they are familiar
with.
I would not expect any better. In fact, I would expect even
worse, from Archeologists of the 'future'.
Presently, not one in a hundred of those practiceing to-day,
could distinguish a Musket 'Flint' from some Amarind
'hide-scraper', let alone the rest of it...nor have they any
experience with either activity TO have any notions based on
experience.
Nor, knowing how do do anything with 'things', having never
made things or made things as function, or having done
anything WITH the things they find to test the functions
they attribute, have they a famialiarity as to allow an
understanding of the Tools, Impliments or abstracts of them
when they do find them...
That has been my experience anyway...so far as the ones I
have met...and, of the Books of the subject as I have
read...
I see lots of errors of judgement, interpolation,
projection, transferance, and complaiscency of repeating
what they were told or read, and not examining it for
themselves in some light as may be deferential to the
Artifact itself, as itself...as, they do not have that other
'light' to do so in...
Phil
lasvegas
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Jensen"
> Lee;
> Probably the archaeologist of the future would be more
able than we to
> see the urinal as DuChamp saw it, as your science fiction
movie
> suggests. I think DuChamp may have been attempting to
undermine
> habitual modes of perception and appropriate the
sculptural qualities of
> the porcelain fixture. I'm assuming that you think the
teabowl would
> endure as a work of art ant the toilet would be seen as a
purely
> functional object, but you might be wrong. Your example
if far from
> clear or conclusive. Or so it seems to me.
>
> John Jensen, Mudbug Pottery
> mudbug@toadhouse.com , http://www.toadhouse.com
>
> Lee said >
> I remember a science
> fiction short story, where archeologists of the future dig
up the
> remains of
> our culture. Mostly, what they find are porcelain
toilets. All the
> metals and plastics have dissolved. They think that
these toilets are
> some type of altar or object of worship. Lee In Mashiko<
>
>
____________________________________________________________
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at melpots@pclink.com.
Maurice Weitman on sun 28 dec 03
Archeologists of the future...
Carol, your post was not a bit off-topic. The=20
Battle of Agincourt was won by the Brits largely=20
because of... MUD.
The French, despite outnumbering King Harry's=20
merry men by more than four to one (25,000 vs.=20
<6,000), made some tactical errors and blew their=20
advantage. Among the most egregious oversights=20
were not checking with weather.com and not doing=20
soil testing before the battle.
Their heavily armored (and therefore=20
overweighted) mounted and unmounted soldiers=20
literally sunk into the mud of the narrow pass in=20
which the battle was fought. This was in part=20
due to the heavy rains immediately preceding the=20
battle, but also because of a peculiarity of the=20
makeup of the soil that made the clay=20
particularly sticky. Neither the horses nor foot=20
soldiers could move with the agility of the=20
unarmored British troops. In this mud, the=20
=46rench literally fell down and couldn't get up.
Had the rain not come so heavily those days=20
before St. Crispian's Day nearly 600 years ago,=20
Janet would be named Jeanete and would likely be=20
eating pat=E9 instead of haggis. British castles=20
would be guarded by French soldiers who would=20
mercilessly taunt English-speaking visitors. And=20
who knows what power les fous Quebecois might be=20
yielding these days? Tony and Sheila would=20
likely be in a tiny English-speaking enclave in=20
the French superpower's western hemisphere=20
province called not L'Am=E9rique-nord, but La=20
=46rance-ouest, and south of Ron Roi's outpost, the=20
buffalo and Algonquin would roam free; no golden=20
arches in sight.
By the way, I don't know where you all come down=20
on Kenneth Branagh as an actor or director, but=20
his rendition of the St. Crispin's Day speech was=20
mighty moving and convincing to me. But then, I=20
get all choked up over a pot. Which I hope to=20
see again on Tuesday, and maybe meet up with=20
Barbara Brown, who is going to see the Korean=20
exhibit on the weight of my tears.
Regards,
Maurice -- fresh from a six-day, 2,100-mile road=20
trip to family in Santa Monica and Tucson, and=20
back home via the Mojave and an all-too-brief=20
visit with Joyce Lee. We logged license plates=20
from 26 states (did you know that there are 8=20
states that begin with "M" and 8 with "N"?),=20
three Canadian provinces and two Mexican states,=20
saw a road runner, several southwestern red-tail=20
hawks, loads-o-cacti, and some beautiful, big=20
skies with astounding sunrises and sunsets.
At 5:54 PM +0000 on 12/28/03, Carol Tripp wrote:
>Well, we are way OT here but I can't let this one go by without comment.
>
>It was Henry V not IV at Agincourt and the English did, in fact, win there
>and resoundingly.
>Ok, so he died some years later of "camp fever" during another campaign in
>la belle France but let's keep the story straight.
>
>Best regards,
>Carol
>Dubai, UAE
Carol Tripp on sun 28 dec 03
Archeologists of the future...
Well, we are way OT here but I can't let this one go by without comment.
It was Henry V not IV at Agincourt and the English did, in fact, win there
and resoundingly.
Ok, so he died some years later of "camp fever" during another campaign in
la belle France but let's keep the story straight.
Best regards,
Carol
Dubai, UAE
Jan wrote, in part:
>History is studied along with Archaeology, even what they call pre-history.
>Too bad that the thirteenth century didn't know you don't camp on your own
>dead
>and wastes. Maybe Henry IV would have survived longer. Maybe his men could
>have won Agincourt, and come home.
>We will get back to educating people, have faith. And, if some of our books
>survive, then there will be clues. Like Bathroom Humor, and You Know You're
>a
>Redneck When...Jan, the Alleycat.
>
_________________________________________________________________
MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
pdp1@EARTHLINK.NET on sun 28 dec 03
Archeologists of the future...
Hi Carol, All...
Certainly Typhus and Colera have done more through history,
to decimate Soldiers and Civillians alike in times of War or
other similar contention...than had the Sword, the Arrow,
the Onager or other, or, in time, the Gun...
Sad...
Phil
Las Vegas
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carol Tripp"
> Well, we are way OT here but I can't let this one go by
without comment.
>
> It was Henry V not IV at Agincourt and the English did,
in fact, win there
> and resoundingly.
> Ok, so he died some years later of "camp fever" during
another campaign in
> la belle France but let's keep the story straight.
>
> Best regards,
> Carol
> Dubai, UAE
>
>
>
> Jan wrote, in part:
> >History is studied along with Archaeology, even what they
call pre-history.
> >Too bad that the thirteenth century didn't know you don't
camp on your own
> >dead
> >and wastes. Maybe Henry IV would have survived longer.
Maybe his men could
> >have won Agincourt, and come home.
> >We will get back to educating people, have faith. And, if
some of our books
> >survive, then there will be clues. Like Bathroom Humor,
and You Know You're
> >a
> >Redneck When...Jan, the Alleycat.
> >
>
>
____________________________________________________________
_____
> MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
>
>
____________________________________________________________
__________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your
subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached
at melpots@pclink.com.
Jan L. Peterson on sun 28 dec 03
Archeologists of the future...
OK. Henry V, then. Wasn't sure. Thought his son was Vth, the one who was so
religious. Yes, I mention that he won there. But, like Pompeii's father,
Pompeii Strabo, he also lived, or rather camped too near the dead and the latrines
(or lack of them), and a lot of his victorious Army died of Enteric fever,
Dysentery, and probably a host of nasty little diseases before they moved on.
Re-read post. All that's wrong is which number Henry.
I am glad to find another English History buff. Jan, the Alleycat.
kruzewski on mon 29 dec 03
Archeologists of the future...
Sorry Folks, I know thios is nit-picking and probably very irritating BUT,
Janet Kaiser lives in WALES, as do I - about 3 miles away from her in the
mountains of Snowdonia. And although Janet may have written about haggis, in
this part of Britain we definately do not eat haggis - that is a Scottish
delicacy - about 600 miles north. It may not alter your main point I know,
but we in Wales get pretty fed up of not existing.
Oh, and by the way - the French may not be taunting English speaking
visitors - but the some of Welsh most certainly do - unfortuantely. The old
English-Welsh hostilities are still alive in the memories of many people
hereabouts!
Jacqui
North Wales
----- Original Message -----
From: "Maurice Weitman"
To:
Sent: Monday, December 29, 2003 7:47 AM
Subject: Re: thoughts on art / craft/toilets - and, Archeologists of the
future...
Had the rain not come so heavily those days
before St. Crispian's Day nearly 600 years ago,
Janet would be named Jeanete and would likely be
eating paté instead of haggis. British castles
would be guarded by French soldiers who would
mercilessly taunt English-speaking visitors.
Jan L. Peterson on wed 31 dec 03
Archeologists of the future...
It was a brilliant win over the French. Don't be forgetting the French pride
helped do them in, too. But, it was unsanitary conditions there that decimated
the English soldiers, Especially the Gentry. Jan, the Alleycat
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