Russel Fouts on sun 4 jan 04
What does that mean, really?
I'm using Ferro frits 3124 and 3195 in my miaolica glaze. Tony Hanson's
site says that both are not suitable for iron colors.
Thanks in advance.
Russel in Belgium where frits are a delicacy, twice cooked and served
with mayonaise, YMMMMMM! Also not suitable for iron colors but WHO
CARES!
--
Russel Fouts
Mes Potes & Mes Pots
Brussels, Belgium
Tel: +32 2 223 02 75
Mobile: +32 476 55 38 75
Http://www.mypots.com
Home of "The Potters Portal"
Over 1800 Pottery Links!
Updated frequently
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president,
or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong,
is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable
to the American public."
U.S. President (and Nobel Peace Prize winner) Theodore Roosevelt.
Ababi on sun 4 jan 04
You know Russel, I almost admire Tony Hansen.
However, when it comes to rules I try to see what happens if I do the
opposite of what the well knowing people or the good books are saying.
The only thing comes to my mind without checking is the high alumina in
both frits. Does it disturb? I do not know, in any case the frit is part
of a recipe, not alone.
Ababi Sharon
Glaze addict
Kibbutz Shoval Israel
ababisha@shoval.org.il
http://ababi.active.co.il
http://www.matrix2000.co.nz/Matrix%20Demo/Ababi.htm
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Russel
Fouts
Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2004 12:47 PM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Frit "Bad" for Iron Colors
What does that mean, really?
I'm using Ferro frits 3124 and 3195 in my miaolica glaze. Tony Hanson's
site says that both are not suitable for iron colors.
Thanks in advance.
Russel in Belgium where frits are a delicacy, twice cooked and served
with mayonaise, YMMMMMM! Also not suitable for iron colors but WHO
CARES!
--
Russel Fouts
Mes Potes & Mes Pots
Brussels, Belgium
Tel: +32 2 223 02 75
Mobile: +32 476 55 38 75
Http://www.mypots.com
Home of "The Potters Portal"
Over 1800 Pottery Links!
Updated frequently
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president,
or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong,
is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable
to the American public."
U.S. President (and Nobel Peace Prize winner) Theodore Roosevelt.
________________________________________________________________________
______
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
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Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Dave Finkelnburg on sun 4 jan 04
Russel,
In his book on ash glazes Tichane shows several examples of high-calcium
glazes "bleaching" iron. By themselves both the frits you use have about
2/3-calcia, 1/3-sodia in the Seger formula. Perhaps this "bleaching" effect
is what Mr. Hansen is referring to.
Good glazing!
Dave Finkelnburg
----- Original Message -----
From: "Russel Fouts"
Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2004 3:47 AM
Subject: Frit "Bad" for Iron Colors
>What does that mean, really?
> I'm using Ferro frits 3124 and 3195 in my miaolica glaze. Tony Hanson's
> site says that both are not suitable for iron colors.
Ron Roy on sun 4 jan 04
Hi Russel,
I think Dave is right on re the CaO - find a boron frit with less CaO for
starters.
I think alumina is OK with iron - and tin is a wonder.
RR
> In his book on ash glazes Tichane shows several examples of high-calcium
>glazes "bleaching" iron. By themselves both the frits you use have about
>2/3-calcia, 1/3-sodia in the Seger formula. Perhaps this "bleaching" effect
>is what Mr. Hansen is referring to.
> Good glazing!
> Dave Finkelnburg
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Russel Fouts"
>Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2004 3:47 AM
>Subject: Frit "Bad" for Iron Colors
>>What does that mean, really?
>> I'm using Ferro frits 3124 and 3195 in my miaolica glaze. Tony Hanson's
>> site says that both are not suitable for iron colors.
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
Ron Roy
RR#4
15084 Little Lake Road
Brighton, Ontario
Canada
K0K 1H0
Phone: 613-475-9544
Fax: 613-475-3513
Earl Krueger on mon 5 jan 04
I tried using mixtures of red iron oxide, black iron oxide and frit
3134 to paint designs under MC6G High Calcium Semi Matte #2 glaze on a
cone 6 porcelain.
Where paint was thin the color washed out completely. Where thick it
was a rich dark brown. Interestingly there was not much gradation
between the two. Seemed like it went one way or the other.
This leads me to believe that there might be a dissolution or
complexing of the iron with some component of the glaze resulting in a
colorless glass. However, once the stoichiometric amount of iron is
exceeded, by even a small amount, the color develops quickly.
This needs more testing.
Earl...
Bothell, WA, USA
Ababi on mon 5 jan 04
In any case when I try or formulate a new glaze I open one of "the
books" Val Cushing Lana Wilson or Tony Hansen's or even my own knowledge
to see how each oxide of the formula might effect on the different
coloring oxides -I might use. I do not see it as a bad option to have
yellow from iron and I do like the zinc iron connection in spite of the
written words in these books!
Ababi Sharon
Glaze addict
Kibbutz Shoval Israel
ababisha@shoval.org.il
http://ababi.active.co.il
http://www.matrix2000.co.nz/Matrix%20Demo/Ababi.htm
.
Sandy Henderson on tue 6 jan 04
I am confused about this: I have used iron with the high calcium matts from
Mastering Cone 6 Glazes -- they have Frit 3195 and are quite lovely. Sienna is one
from the book. Does a maiolica glaze have different requirements?
Thanks,
Sandy Henderson
lurking and learning in NW Indiana
> From: Ron Roy
> Subject: Re: Frit "Bad" for Iron Colors
>
> Hi Russel,
>
> I think Dave is right on re the CaO - find a boron frit with less CaO
> for starters.
>
> I think alumina is OK with iron - and tin is a wonder.
>
> RR
>
>
> > In his book on ash glazes Tichane shows several examples of
> > high-calcium
> >glazes "bleaching" iron. By themselves both the frits you use have
> >about 2/3-calcia, 1/3-sodia in the Seger formula. Perhaps this
> >"bleaching" effect is what Mr. Hansen is referring to.
> > Good glazing!
> > Dave Finkelnburg
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Russel Fouts"
> >Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2004 3:47 AM
> >Subject: Frit "Bad" for Iron Colors
> >>What does that mean, really?
> >> I'm using Ferro frits 3124 and 3195 in my miaolica glaze. Tony
> >> Hanson's site says that both are not suitable for iron colors.
iandol on tue 6 jan 04
Dave Finkelnburg provided us with this information <glazes Tichane shows several examples of high-calcium glazes "bleaching" =
iron. >>
Sounds as though this thread is about observations of a phenomenon which =
is inexplicable using the artistic mind set. What qualities has Calcium =
oxide which would account for this effect. Without a definition of =
"Unbleached Iron" it is a bit difficult know what is being talked about =
in this thread when it is claimed "Iron is bleached from the glaze". =
Does it mean we loose the red oranges typical of undissolved rust? Does =
it mean that it is decolourised to the extent that the glaze is White? =
or are we getting a dirty grey?
There will be a chemistry happening in the kiln to cause this effect. =
But without valid facts no answer can be given.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis. Redhill, South Australia
Ababi on wed 7 jan 04
In the glaze you are talking about from R&J book as well as any other
brown glaze the originator when he planed it decided to use the
chemicals in order to achieve a certain result. This glaze ( My R&J book
in the studio, so I do not know what there is) Mike Bailey used iron
with lithium and achieved red or in another case high magnesia and got
matt with crystals.
The majolica on the other hand is a canvas, you paint over it. Russel
was write to worry, if he would try to use natural oxides instead of
artificial stains (Mason in Americanish) - Using a stain for brown and
having it yellow might be a disappointment.
I want to share with you a test I made:
Because I converted this glaze to my material I shall go back to the
original:
From The Ceramic Web:
Glaze Name: Emily's Blue
cone: 6
color:
surface:?
firing:Untested
date: 6/3/96
recipe:
36.56 Custer Feldspar
19.35 Gerstley Borate
11.83 OM-4 Ball Clay
15.05 Talc
10.75 Silica
6.45 Dolomite
100.00 % Totals:
Also add:
4.30 Zircopax
3.23 Cobalt Carbonate
We shall do it this way:
EMILY IN THE SNOW BASED ON A CLA
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Cone 6 1222 deg.C. -
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Custer feldspar 21.00
Ferro 3134 20.00
OM-4 Ball Clay 21.00
talc NYtal 15.00
silica 6.00
Dolomite 7.00
ultrox 10.00
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Seger Weight%
KNO 0.196 5.48%
CaO 0.392 8.36%
MgO 0.412 6.31%
Al2O3 0.259 10.04%
B2O3 0.189 4.99%
SiO2 2.509 57.30%
ZrO2 0.155 7.25%
TiO2 0.009 0.27%
K2O 0.071 2.54%
Na2O 0.125 2.95%
Al:Si 9.67
Expan. 6.44
ST 363.60
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Use this white glaze as a canvas paint over with cobalt oxide or
carbonate or make stamps using foam. Just remember the cobalt will
appear violet while other colors- I do not what to say the word...
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Ababi Sharon
Glaze addict
Kibbutz Shoval Israel
ababisha@shoval.org.il
http://ababi.active.co.il
http://www.matrix2000.co.nz/Matrix%20Demo/Ababi.htm
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Sandy
Henderson
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 6:44 AM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: Frit "Bad" for Iron Colors
I am confused about this: I have used iron with the high calcium matts
from
Mastering Cone 6 Glazes -- they have Frit 3195 and are quite lovely.
Sienna is one
from the book. Does a maiolica glaze have different requirements?
Thanks,
Sandy Henderson
lurking and learning in NW Indiana
> From: Ron Roy
> Subject: Re: Frit "Bad" for Iron Colors
>
> Hi Russel,
>
> I think Dave is right on re the CaO - find a boron frit with less CaO
> for starters.
>
> I think alumina is OK with iron - and tin is a wonder.
>
> RR
>
>
> > In his book on ash glazes Tichane shows several examples of
> > high-calcium
> >glazes "bleaching" iron. By themselves both the frits you use have
> >about 2/3-calcia, 1/3-sodia in the Seger formula. Perhaps this
> >"bleaching" effect is what Mr. Hansen is referring to.
> > Good glazing!
> > Dave Finkelnburg
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Russel Fouts"
> >Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2004 3:47 AM
> >Subject: Frit "Bad" for Iron Colors
> >>What does that mean, really?
> >> I'm using Ferro frits 3124 and 3195 in my miaolica glaze. Tony
> >> Hanson's site says that both are not suitable for iron colors.
________________________________________________________________________
______
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Russel Fouts on wed 7 jan 04
Thanks for your input guys, I got the test tile back and I think he means
that the iron colors won't be "nice". This was in a neutral / oxidizing
envinronment. The red iron and black iron oxides both turned a bit green.
Not really unattactive but not a nice brown or black like I think I might
have expected. The Yellow ochre washed out entirely where thin. Where
thicker, it was still a pretty washed out brown. The surprise was my body
clay which also washed out where thin but where thicker gave a nice light
brown.
To see what "nice" might be I should probably test with a glaze with less
calcia in it or with a lead glaze but I probably won't since this is the
glaze I'm using and love.
Russel "Live and Learn" and "Row with the oars you have" Fouts
PS. Hopefully I have both oars in the water. ;-)
Russel Fouts
Mes Potes & Mes Pots
Brussels, Belgium
Tel: +32 2 223 02 75
Mobile: +32 476 55 38 75
Http://www.mypots.com
Home of "The Potters Portal"
Over 2300 Pottery Related Links!
Updated frequently
My work can also be seen on:
The World Crafts Council International Site: http://www.wccwis.gr
The World Crafts Council Belgium Site: http://wcc-bf.org (English Pages)
EasyCraft: http://www.easycraft.org
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
we are to stand by the president, right or wrong, is not only
unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American
public." --U.S. President (and Nobel Peace Prize winner) Theodore
Roosevelt.
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