Kevin Ritter on thu 5 feb 04
I have a gallery that placed an order, after receiving it, the woman called
and said she didn't like two of the pieces, one had a "funny mark in the glaze"
the other for undetermined reasons. I didn't question her, my thinking
being, as my customer she has the right to return anything she doesn't like and
have it replace. I told her I would issue a call tag, she said the pieces were
packed and ready to go. I immediately sent two replacement pieces without the
"funny" marks in the glaze.
When to box arrived with the offending pieces, one was completely smashed,
the other somehow made it, they were so poorly packed I'm not sure they would
have made it if they were hand carried the whole way. The insurance will not
cover the loss because they were "improperly packed" which I agree with. My
point is that I should not have to absorb the loss because of her lack of concern
about handling my work.
The question is, should I require her to pay for the piece or should I just
chalk it up as one more loss? I'm sure if I broke something in her gallery, I
would have to pay. Any guidance would be appreciated.
Thank,
Kevin
Lucy Reuther on thu 5 feb 04
This is my response to the question about how to treat a customer who
sent back improperly wrapped pieces.
I would send her a nice note hoping the new pieces were suitable and
inform her that because of improper packaging both returned pieces were
damaged and not salvageable. Tell her the delivery company's insurance
would not cover the cost because of the packaging and you are now out
the value of the two pieces Give her a chance to do the right thing and
offer to pay for them. If she does not respond I would then send her a
bill for the damaged pieces. She may not realize that she did such a
poor job of packaging and if you wish to do business in the future you
don't want to alienate her now. However, if she refuses to pay or tries
to blame you for the damage then I would write her off my customer
list.
Hope this helps
LucyLee
william schran on thu 5 feb 04
Kevin wrote:>The insurance will not cover the loss because they were
"improperly packed" which I agree with. My point is that I should
not have to absorb the loss because of her lack of concern
about handling my work.... The question is, should I require her to
pay for the piece or should I just
chalk it up as one more loss?... Any guidance would be appreciated<
Kevin - Though I'm not currently doing any wholesaling or shipping of
my work - just working with local folks for now - my wife & I did run
a gallery for 10 years and did run across breakage issues
occasionally - artists shipping to us. Anything I ever sent out was
never broken. I always used double boxing, etc. Oh yeah, one thing
did get broken, but the UPS truck ran over the box! And to further my
experience, I worked in a UPS shipping hub one summer - lots of boxes
really get thrown around there.
Anyway, how much are you out - cost of work + shipping? Is it worth
your time to fight for the money? If not, perhaps a letter to the
gallery owner explaining the situation asking if she is willing to
pay for the piece that was broken or at least share in the cost.
Next thing, clearly write in your wholesale agreement/contract, your
policy for returns. Perhaps "buyer is responsible for return shipping
and insurance costs" and "all returns must be in original packaging".
Just some ideas. I remember when we got fragile things shipped to us,
there was often a similar kind of return policy.
Perhaps if the gallery owner had to pay for return shipping, she may
have elected to keep the original works.
Bill
John Rodgers on thu 5 feb 04
You probably will have to bite the bullet on this one, or lose a customer.
Here are some "after the fact" comments about things you probably have
thought of by now.
One: You should have received back the returned goods before shipping
the replacements.
Two: You should have had better return policy, in place in writing, sent
to all customers before the fact.
Three: Replacements should always be billed, regardless, including
freight and insurance.
Four: Any action on works already shipped and invoiced should be
handled strictly as separate issues from the replacement shipments.
Five: A formal credit document should be issued on any returned items,
minus any actionable amounts. DO NOT deduct the amount of the invoice
for the returned item(s) from any later invoices.
By separating the activity between the two shipments, they also become
separate issues if things go to hell in a handbasket and you wind up in
court over it. On the one hand you have an item that was returned for
whatever reason, and that can legitimately be arugued over. However, the
second item, which was shipped and invoiced separately, and hopefully
received properly, is a completely separate purchase, not "just a
replacement". You will have the law on your side in that case. But for
the former, you could very well lose the dispute in court.
You could just excercise the option of just letting it all go, and
chalking it up to experience, and getting a good program into place to
cover any future difficulties. This probably is the better choice.
As the little boy sez " Youse makes youse choices, takes youse chances,
and pays for youse experience!"
Regards,
John Rodgers
Chelsea, AL
Kevin Ritter wrote:
>I have a gallery that placed an order, after receiving it, the woman called
>and said she didn't like two of the pieces, one had a "funny mark in the glaze"
>the other for undetermined reasons. I didn't question her, my thinking
>being, as my customer she has the right to return anything she doesn't like and
>have it replace. I told her I would issue a call tag, she said the pieces were
>packed and ready to go. I immediately sent two replacement pieces without the
>"funny" marks in the glaze.
>
>When to box arrived with the offending pieces, one was completely smashed,
>the other somehow made it, they were so poorly packed I'm not sure they would
>have made it if they were hand carried the whole way. The insurance will not
>cover the loss because they were "improperly packed" which I agree with. My
>point is that I should not have to absorb the loss because of her lack of concern
>about handling my work.
>
>The question is, should I require her to pay for the piece or should I just
>chalk it up as one more loss? I'm sure if I broke something in her gallery, I
>would have to pay. Any guidance would be appreciated.
>
>Thank,
>Kevin
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
>
SusanRaku@AOL.COM on thu 5 feb 04
In a message dated 2/5/2004 9:53:51 AM Eastern Standard Time,
Spiritclay@AOL.COM writes:
I agree that you should not have to absorb the loss. However I would not
turn this into a confrontation. I would simply return the broken piece to her
exactly how she sent it and write a note saying that unfortunately UPS will not
cover the expense because of the improper packing. That said, I would just
wait to see how she responds. You will soon know what type of person you are
dealing with. If you do not receive payment for your cost I would not
continue to do business with this person.
Susan
> When to box arrived with the offending pieces, one was completely smashed,
> tI ahe other somehow made it, they were so poorly packed I'm not sure they
> would
> have made it if they were hand carried the whole way. The insurance will
> not
> cover the loss because they were "improperly packed" which I agree with. My
> point is that I should not have to absorb the loss because of her lack of
> concern
> about handling my work.
>
>
Antoinette Badenhorst on thu 5 feb 04
Kevin, I would say you should evaluate her as a customer in the first
place. How much did she buy in the past and how much she will buy in
future? If she is a good customer and are seriously interested in a long
time relation with you, she will be willing to negotiate with you. If
not, it is not worth it to do further business with her, in which case
you might want to insist in her paying you for the damage. It might be
that she had someone else packing the piece. Employees do not always
care for the work or they might be poorly trained.
Another way of working with it is by simply adding the cost gradually to
other pieces that you sell to her.
Hope this is worth your reading.
Antoinette Badenhorst
105 Westwood Circle
Saltillo MS
38866
662 869 1651
www.clayandcanvas.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Kevin
Ritter
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 7:19 AM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Wholesale question
I have a gallery that placed an order, after receiving it, the woman
called
and said she didn't like two of the pieces, one had a "funny mark in the
glaze"
the other for undetermined reasons. I didn't question her, my thinking
being, as my customer she has the right to return anything she doesn't
like and
have it replace. I told her I would issue a call tag, she said the
pieces were
packed and ready to go. I immediately sent two replacement pieces
without the
"funny" marks in the glaze.
When to box arrived with the offending pieces, one was completely
smashed,
the other somehow made it, they were so poorly packed I'm not sure they
would
have made it if they were hand carried the whole way. The insurance
will not
cover the loss because they were "improperly packed" which I agree with.
My
point is that I should not have to absorb the loss because of her lack
of concern
about handling my work.
The question is, should I require her to pay for the piece or should I
just
chalk it up as one more loss? I'm sure if I broke something in her
gallery, I
would have to pay. Any guidance would be appreciated.
Thank,
Kevin
________________________________________________________________________
______
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melpots@pclink.com.
Gordon Ward on thu 5 feb 04
Hi Kevin,
I always wait to see if the complaint is in left field or legitimate.
Sometimes it's within the normal range of variation.
I would tell the person that it wasn't packed well enough for the insurance
to cover it. If she volunteers to pay for it, you have a good customer, if
not, you may question how the relationship is going to do long term.
Good luck,
Gordon
> From: Kevin Ritter
> Reply-To: Clayart
> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 08:18:40 EST
> To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
> Subject: Wholesale question
>
> I have a gallery that placed an order, after receiving it, the woman called
> and said she didn't like two of the pieces, one had a "funny mark in the
> glaze"
> the other for undetermined reasons. I didn't question her, my thinking
> being, as my customer she has the right to return anything she doesn't like
> and
> have it replace. I told her I would issue a call tag, she said the pieces
> were
> packed and ready to go. I immediately sent two replacement pieces without the
> "funny" marks in the glaze.
>
> When to box arrived with the offending pieces, one was completely smashed,
> the other somehow made it, they were so poorly packed I'm not sure they would
> have made it if they were hand carried the whole way. The insurance will not
> cover the loss because they were "improperly packed" which I agree with. My
> point is that I should not have to absorb the loss because of her lack of
> concern
> about handling my work.
>
> The question is, should I require her to pay for the piece or should I just
> chalk it up as one more loss? I'm sure if I broke something in her gallery, I
> would have to pay. Any guidance would be appreciated.
>
> Thank,
> Kevin
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
Scott Ackerman on thu 5 feb 04
Kevin,
The answer is actually pretty simple. Do you want to keep her as a =
customer?
"Every improvement in the standard of work men do is followed swiftly =
and
inevitably by an improvement in the men who do it" - William Morris
=20
Scott Ackerman
1133 Riverside
Suite B
Fort Collins, CO 80524
970-231-9035
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Kevin =
Ritter
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 6:19 AM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Wholesale question
I have a gallery that placed an order, after receiving it, the woman =
called
and said she didn't like two of the pieces, one had a "funny mark in the
glaze"
the other for undetermined reasons. I didn't question her, my thinking
being, as my customer she has the right to return anything she doesn't =
like
and
have it replace. I told her I would issue a call tag, she said the =
pieces
were
packed and ready to go. I immediately sent two replacement pieces =
without
the
"funny" marks in the glaze.
When to box arrived with the offending pieces, one was completely =
smashed,
the other somehow made it, they were so poorly packed I'm not sure they
would
have made it if they were hand carried the whole way. The insurance =
will
not
cover the loss because they were "improperly packed" which I agree with. =
My
point is that I should not have to absorb the loss because of her lack =
of
concern
about handling my work.
The question is, should I require her to pay for the piece or should I =
just
chalk it up as one more loss? I'm sure if I broke something in her =
gallery,
I
would have to pay. Any guidance would be appreciated.
Thank,
Kevin
_________________________________________________________________________=
___
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Ivor and Olive Lewis on fri 6 feb 04
Dear Kevin Ritter,
I suppose we all suffer form this sort of experience form time to
time.
I look at this way. If the person responsible is so inconsiderate as
to improperly pack the goods they will be careless in other
situations. The behaviour of such a customer seems to imply a lack of
professionalism and they will never serve their suppliers best
interests. I would withdraw my cooperation and cease to deal with
them.
Bear a small loss now rather than a huge one at some future date.
I hope you get a satisfactory resolution to this problem.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis. Redhill, South Australia
The Chapel of Art on fri 6 feb 04
Kevin... You have already received some very sound advice from
others. I have a question and something to add for your future
consideration... You say "wholesale". You sell to her outright?
In which case, do you have a set production list and catalogue,
so she simply re-orders so many Ritter jugs in various sizes, X
mugs, pots, vases, in blue, brown and black, etc. or are you
sending a selection of what you think she may like design wise?
I ask because to be honest, the fact she does not like a piece
and/or there was a speckle or slight variation in the glaze is
neither here nor there (presuming you did check for real faults
before shipping?!?). If she ordered what you sent and she
received, so she has no moral right to demand you replace
anything she "does not like". In the UK she would have no legal
right either, but what the "law" in your country/state says may
be another matter. She has every right if truly faulty, a
different size/colour to what was ordered, malfunctioning, etc.
etc. but I advise you slow down on jumping to fulfil that type of
replacement "on demand". Do not automatically think "the customer
is king"... Depending on its prevalence and/or your luck, this
type of situation may make enough of a difference to make or
break a new venture or enterprise. You do not want and truly
cannot afford a reputation for being a push-over!
It has been mentioned before, but I think it is worth
repeating... Sometimes potters/makers have to forget the best
case scenario or what they themselves would expect as a customer
or consumer! I know there are different levels of consumer
expectations around the world, but in the USA it would appear
that the customer is not only always right, but can often get
away with murder, always leaving the manufacturer/supplier to pay
the price and bare the cost. That is all well and good when this
sort of *immoral behaviour* can be fractured into the costs of a
large, established business, but small businesses cannot afford
that sort of largesse nor is it fair for all the other good,
honest customers who end up paying. And yes, I think ordering
stuff to see if it really is as good as it looks in the catalogue
or because they "fancy it" or heard it was great from their
second cousin twice removed living out in Australia, then
returning it for no other reason than the dog sniffed & turned up
its nose, really is immoral!! It is certainly a misuse / abuse of
goodwill...
Your sentence, "I didn't question her, my thinking being, as my
customer she has the right to return anything she doesn't like
and have it replaced." gives me the impression you have a way to
go on learning how to be Mr. Tough when dealing with clients of
this type...! You can remain Mr. Nice, but as others have
recommended, you need to put some rules into place if you are
going to survive at this "game".
The middle men & women (galleries, shops, etc.) are NOT the same
as personal clients or the people at the end of the
production/consumer chain. They are (or claim to be) fellow
professionals, who should be working towards building up a good
working relationship with you. The relationship may well develop
into a true friendship, but even the most cursory business
relationship takes a lot of time and effort to establish and
grow. So as others have mentioned, this sort of disrespect for
your work is an ill-omen for future co-operation. Far from the
excuse someone suggested, it is also just as bad as (if not worse
than) simply packing poorly themselves, if they have
inexperienced staff packing return shipments... IMO paying
someone to send your work/property back knowing it will arrive as
shards is actually a grave insult ...!!
Just my tupence ha'penny worth!
Sincerely
Janet Kaiser
***********************************************************
The Chapel of Art : Capel Celfyddyd
8 Marine Crescent : Criccieth : Wales : UK
Home of The International Potters' Path
Tel: ++44 (01766) 523570 http://www.the-coa.org.uk
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