logan johnson on sun 22 feb 04
Hi Lor & Jas,
AH! Point understood ( The light dawns! Sorry, it must have been a loose bulb!)
L . J.
Lor & Jas White wrote:
Hi,
Just wanted to say I painted my garage studio floor with DryLock a concrete
paint. I love it! Before when I would mop up it would just make a mess and
most of the water would absorb into the concrete. Now it all stays above
until the mess is gone. Its really good cuz where I live there is about
100% humidity at all times and things never dry out and mold forms easily.
With the floors sealed it makes a world of difference!
Loryn White
----- Original Message -----
From: "logan johnson"
To:
Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: painting floors
>
>
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__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
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>
> Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
> www.audeostudios.com
> "Carpe Argillam!!"
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
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______________________________________________________________________________
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www.audeostudios.com
"Carpe Argillam!!"
logan johnson on sun 22 feb 04
Hi Donna ,
I guess my first question is why are you painting the floor in the first place? I personally would save the money to be used on paint & use it for tools, shelfs or supplies. But, that's just me. If you're gonna paint the floor I suggest you use paint made for concrete.
I suggest concrete board (similar to drywall but made of concrete) for around the kilns, no need to paint!
Donna Hoff-Grambau wrote:
I am in the final stages of putting a studio together - painting the
walls and the cement floor. Is there a type of paint for the walls in
the section that houses the kilns that is better than latex??? Any
recommendations for painting the cement floor?
"Too often we underestimate the power of a touch, a smile, a kind word,
a listening ear, an honest compliment, or the smallest act of caring,
all of which have the potential to turn a life around." --Leo Buscaglia
Donna Hoff-Grambau
Two Rivers Paper & Pottery
______________________________________________________________________________
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www.audeostudios.com
"Carpe Argillam!!"
Lor & Jas White on sun 22 feb 04
Hi,
Just wanted to say I painted my garage studio floor with DryLock a concrete
paint. I love it! Before when I would mop up it would just make a mess and
most of the water would absorb into the concrete. Now it all stays above
until the mess is gone. Its really good cuz where I live there is about
100% humidity at all times and things never dry out and mold forms easily.
With the floors sealed it makes a world of difference!
Loryn White
----- Original Message -----
From: "logan johnson"
To:
Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: painting floors
> Hi Donna ,
> I guess my first question is why are you painting the floor in the first
place? I personally would save the money to be used on paint & use it for
tools, shelfs or supplies. But, that's just me. If you're gonna paint the
floor I suggest you use paint made for concrete.
>
> I suggest concrete board (similar to drywall but made of concrete) for
around the kilns, no need to paint!
>
> Donna Hoff-Grambau wrote:
> I am in the final stages of putting a studio together - painting the
> walls and the cement floor. Is there a type of paint for the walls in
> the section that houses the kilns that is better than latex??? Any
> recommendations for painting the cement floor?
>
>
>
> "Too often we underestimate the power of a touch, a smile, a kind word,
> a listening ear, an honest compliment, or the smallest act of caring,
> all of which have the potential to turn a life around." --Leo Buscaglia
>
> Donna Hoff-Grambau
> Two Rivers Paper & Pottery
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
> Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
> www.audeostudios.com
> "Carpe Argillam!!"
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
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>
Lee love on mon 23 feb 04
I'd vote against painting a cement floor. The first thing I do in the
studio in the morning, after starting a fire and putting the foot
warming water bottles on the woodstove, is sprinkle the cement floor
with a watering can. Your water absorbent cement floor is your
friend. It keeps the dust out of the air.
Silica dust is the single most hazardous material every potter
has to deal with. The old dirt floors in the traditional Japanese
potterys are excellent for keeping silica dust out of the air.
Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out. ;^)
Lee in Mashiko, Japan
logan johnson on mon 23 feb 04
Hi Lor & Jas,
After getting some sleep I have one question about your painted floor . Doesn't it make the floor slippery (dangerous) when the floor is wet ? Big safety issue for me since I now walk with a cane & a trashed ankle do to a slippery floor.
L .J.
logan johnson wrote:
Hi Lor & Jas,
AH! Point understood ( The light dawns! Sorry, it must have been a loose bulb!)
L . J.
Lor & Jas White wrote:
Hi,
Just wanted to say I painted my garage studio floor with DryLock a concrete
paint. I love it! Before when I would mop up it would just make a mess and
most of the water would absorb into the concrete. Now it all stays above
until the mess is gone. Its really good cuz where I live there is about
100% humidity at all times and things never dry out and mold forms easily.
With the floors sealed it makes a world of difference!
Loryn White
----- Original Message -----
From: "logan johnson"
To:
Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: painting floors
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
> Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
> www.audeostudios.com
> "Carpe Argillam!!"
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
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>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
______________________________________________________________________________
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You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
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Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
www.audeostudios.com
"Carpe Argillam!!"
______________________________________________________________________________
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"Carpe Argillam!!"
Carl Finch on mon 23 feb 04
I just ran across this message posted to alt.home.repair this
morning. The writer wanted to"give back" to the news group for the help
he had received in the past.
Any wonder I'm guessin' he's an Engineer?! :-)
=========alt.home.repair===========
My experience and tips after epoxying my garage floor.
I epoxied my garage floor with Benjamin Moore's Industrial Maintenance
Coatings, 2-part epoxy, M36/M39 Polyamide Epoxy Gloss Coating .
The results were spectacular in terms of finish and I have had no hot-tire
lifting at all. Most dirt just sweeps off. Oils just come up with a paper
towel. This is impressive given that I had a previous 'paint' (supposedly
some new type of epoxy) done by a contractor. Not only did it lift under
car tires, it lifted under a bicycle tire!
Here is what I did and learned.
1. Prep is critical, as all the brochures say. While my prior coating came
up easily in some places, it did not in others. I ended up renting a Hilti
hand-held grinder-vac at Sunbelt Rental and grinding the entire floor. It's
a hands-and-knees job, and time consuming, but it took me down to bare
concrete and also removed some of the bumps and splotches from a lousy
concrete job. Wear knee pads and ear protection. I actually used the small
foam ear plugs underneath a noise-attenuating headset. And wear eye
protection because of the concrete dust thrown by the grinder.
My hope for your sake is that you don't have any prior paint and don't
have to go through a similar grinding step.
2. Then I washed with TSP and rinsed several times.
3. Then came the muriatic acid etch. It's not as scary as you'd think;
just follow the directions.
But here's a TIP for an issue that I've not seen described anywhere.
Move all iron and steel things out of the garage. If you can't do that wrap
them in plastic. Even the fumes of the muriatic acid makes steel rust very
badly. Tools I had hanging on the wall were covered with rust the following
day.
The second part of the wash with muriatic acid is to neutralize it with
a solution of baking soda. For the concentration mixtures of the acid and
baking soda solution follow instructions provided with the muriatic acid, or
seek someone with experience in a paint store.
3. Then let it dry several days. Use the trick of taping a piece of
plastic over a couple square feet of floor overnight. If it's completely
dry in the morning the floor is probably dry enough. (If water never ceases
to appear under the plastic you've got a water source coming up through the
concrete. If so, paint or epoxy are not going to work, so hang it up.)
4. Then I thought the floor was sufficiently prepared as I was down to bare
concrete everywhere. I was wrong. The test of adequately clean concrete is
to put a drop of water on the surface. It should quickly spread out and be
absorbed. In my several tests I did the water drops penetrated instantly.
A day later I buy the epoxy (which I had tinted). I got home and did the
water drop test again for no reason other than that it made me feel great to
see the water drops instantly penetrate the concrete, given the horrible
condition of the floor I started with. I tapped a few drops on and suddenly
one of them just sat there on the surface. Panic! I then proceeded to get
on my hands and knees and do the droplet test every couple of inches over
the entire garage floor. More places where it didn't absorb, and I put
pieces of sticky notes in each location. When I was done the sticky notes
mapped out areas corresponding almost exactly to where the car tires rest.
In those places water did not absorb. This was shocking because not only
did the concrete look like knew I had ground off the surface with the
grinder. It appears that the petroleum products that are either in the
tires or are picked up from the roads are then pressed onto the concrete and
absorbed. I subsequently did research and read in places that oils and
paints may penetrate to as deep as 3/4 inch in some circumstances.
So I ground those places deeper with little effect but I wasn't about to
grind 3/4 of an inch because then I'd have to patch with concrete, and if I
did that I'd have to wait about 90 days (as I recall) for curing before
applying the epoxy. Finally, not knowing what else to try, I got some
garage floor degreaser at Home Depot and treated those tire areas several
times, as per the label, scrubbing, rinsing well, etc. After several
degreasing cycles the water drops would absorb somewhat in those areas. Not
as well as in all the non-tire areas, but much better than before. For
example, a drop might appear to sit there for 2 seconds, then slowly spread
out and be absorbed. Believing I couldn't improve it further and not really
having any alternatives, I moved on.
[But before doing so, I did another muriatic acid etch (with a higher
concentration) and a baking soda rinse in those areas I had degreased. Then
I waited a few days again for it to dry.]
5. Now time to epoxy. As I said, I used Benjamin Moore's M36+M39. The
paint store may give you 'local wisdom', or experience, or vague guesses.
If you want to double check, Benjamin Moore has corporate technical support
people whom you can call about these products. As it turns out, the owner
of my local Benjamin Moore store had a lot of experience with the product
and was a good source, whereas his employees were not.
You need to know that 2 coats are really recommended to give a good finish.
You may not find this out if you don't talk to the right people, so here's
another tip. As it turns out, the pigment particles in colored epoxies are
larger than the solvent molecules. Epoxy is a strong finish because it
penetrates the crevices (which were caused by the muriatic acid etch) and
when it hardens it 'hooks' into the crevices, which is why it adheres so
well and doesn't lift. But if the penetration into the crevices is impeded,
the epoxy doesn't grab as well so is more likely to lift off. And the
pigment impedes the penetration.
So the officially recommended course is to use a pigment-free first coat.
However, 2 color coats are necessary to give a good finish, so know you'd be
talking about 3 applications (one 'primer' and two color coats) which means
more work and expense.
TIP: You can save one coat by skipping the 'primer' coat and thinning the
1st color coat with epoxy thinner (xylene). [Benjamin Moore sells epoxy
thinner as M95, but I'm pretty sure it's nothing more than straight xylene.]
This is what the owner of the Benjamin Moore store told me. I called the
B/M tech support line and they wouldn't recommend it and said the proper
procedure was the separate 'primer' coat. I went back to the B/M store and
talked to the owner who said that new federal regulations to control
volatile organic compounds (VOCs) don't allow B/M to endorse thinning with
xylene, but that doing so would work just as well as a separate 'primer'
coat. Then I called tech support who admitted they couldn't say much
because of the VOC regulations. So I asked: "If I had come to you before
the VOC regulations and had said that I wanted to thin the first pigmented
coat with xylene and asked you if that would be just as good as using a
separate primer coat would you have said yes?" He said that he would have
said yes. So I got my answer and he remained legal.
My recollection is that I thinned with 1 quart of epoxy thinner (xylene) for
each 2 gallons of epoxy (1 gal of M36 + 1 gal of M39), but I suggest you
check with your paint store.
6. The first application. The obvious means of applying it is rolling it
on, however you can also squeegee it on, which is what I did. The advantage
of using a squeegee is that if you have pits and holes in the concrete
surface you can more nearly fill those with the squeegee than with a roller.
It's fairly easy, but with a fairly smooth concrete surface a roller would
be faster.
Another tip: There is a range of recommended thickness for each coat,
but how do you know you're applying to that thickness and not too thin, or
too thick (which would have the added risk of running out)? I basically
marked out areas along one wall with sticky notes every 4 feet, and along a
perpendicular wall every 5 feet, allowing me to estimate 5'x4' sections, or
20 sq ft. I don't remember the recommended coverage for the 2 mixed
gallons, but let's say for example it should cover 600 square feet. So I
have 2 gallons, or 256 ounces to cover 30 20-sq.ft. sections. So, if I
apply 8 ounces per 4'x5' section I'd use 240 ounces, with just 16 ounces
left over -- pretty close to the exact recommended coverage. (I
intentionally neglected to account for 32 ounces of thinner in the first
coat, as I didn't know if it would add exactly that much volume, and I
wanted to be conservative so I didn't run out.) Anyway, you get the idea.
Do the math to your particular situation.
Then I scooped 8 ounces in a glass cup and drizzled it around each 4'x5'
section and then squeegeed it to cover. (Or in the case of the 2nd coat,
rolled it to cover.) Use a glass cup because xylene eats through plastic.
7. Second coat. It should be ready for a second coat the next day. I
waited until the 2nd day for the second coat. This one I rolled on. I did
not add particulate matter to create an anti-skid surface. I live in the
south where snow and ice are not an issue. Slight wetness hasn't caused a
problem, thought I can see that if you had standing water with smooth-soled
shoes it might be. The downside of sand or some other anti-skid material is
the high points will show wear sooner as the epoxy is abraided from the
points of the sand.
That's it. Wake up the morning after your second coat and go be stunned by
your great garage floor.
Now I feel like I've given something back. I hope this helps someone.
===========end================
--Carl
in Medford, Oregon
piedpotterhamelin@COMCAST.NET on mon 23 feb 04
Hey Carl
You helped me. Got a new floor to paint (new studio) and my wife is already a Benj Moore fan.
Could not be a more perfect match
Thanks
Rick
--
"Many a wiser men than I hath
gone to pot." 1649
Lor & Jas White on mon 23 feb 04
Hi,
Actually no it really doesn't get very slippery at all. I guess because the
cement under the paint isn't all that smooth. Honestly though when I mop up
thats at the end of the day and I mop myself out of the area and don't
really walk on it much but so far I've never came close to slipping.
Loryn
----- Original Message -----
From: "logan johnson"
To:
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 10:00 AM
Subject: Re: painting floors
> Hi Lor & Jas,
> After getting some sleep I have one question about your painted floor .
Doesn't it make the floor slippery (dangerous) when the floor is wet ? Big
safety issue for me since I now walk with a cane & a trashed ankle do to a
slippery floor.
>
L .J.
> logan johnson wrote:
> Hi Lor & Jas,
> AH! Point understood ( The light dawns! Sorry, it must have been a loose
bulb!)
> L . J.
> Lor & Jas White wrote:
> Hi,
> Just wanted to say I painted my garage studio floor with DryLock a
concrete
> paint. I love it! Before when I would mop up it would just make a mess and
> most of the water would absorb into the concrete. Now it all stays above
> until the mess is gone. Its really good cuz where I live there is about
> 100% humidity at all times and things never dry out and mold forms easily.
> With the floors sealed it makes a world of difference!
> Loryn White
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "logan johnson"
> To:
> Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 11:58 AM
> Subject: Re: painting floors
>
>
> >
>
> >
>
____________________________________________________________________________
> __
> > Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
> >
> > You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> > settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
> >
> > Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
> >
> > Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
> > www.audeostudios.com
> > "Carpe Argillam!!"
> >
> >
>
____________________________________________________________________________
> __
> > Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
> >
> > You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> > settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
> >
> > Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
> >
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
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>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
> Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
> www.audeostudios.com
> "Carpe Argillam!!"
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
> Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
> www.audeostudios.com
> "Carpe Argillam!!"
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
logan johnson on tue 24 feb 04
Hi Gang!,
COOL! glad to hear it! After my slip I'm worse than a fanatical reformed smoker preaching to everybody within hearing distance! NOT that I'm saying ANYTHING against people who quit but don't preach!!!! Put the 2 x 4's on the ground & step away from the lumber! :^ D L . J .
Lor & Jas White wrote:
Hi,
Actually no it really doesn't get very slippery at all. I guess because the
cement under the paint isn't all that smooth. Honestly though when I mop up
thats at the end of the day and I mop myself out of the area and don't
really walk on it much but so far I've never came close to slipping.
Loryn
----- Original Message -----
From: "logan johnson"
To:
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 10:00 AM
Subject: Re: painting floors
> Hi Lor & Jas,
> After getting some sleep I have one question about your painted floor .
Doesn't it make the floor slippery (dangerous) when the floor is wet ? Big
safety issue for me since I now walk with a cane & a trashed ankle do to a
slippery floor.
>
L .J.
> logan johnson wrote:
> Hi Lor & Jas,
> AH! Point understood ( The light dawns! Sorry, it must have been a loose
bulb!)
> L . J.
> Lor & Jas White wrote:
> Hi,
> Just wanted to say I painted my garage studio floor with DryLock a
concrete
> paint. I love it! Before when I would mop up it would just make a mess and
> most of the water would absorb into the concrete. Now it all stays above
> until the mess is gone. Its really good cuz where I live there is about
> 100% humidity at all times and things never dry out and mold forms easily.
> With the floors sealed it makes a world of difference!
> Loryn White
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "logan johnson"
> To:
> Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 11:58 AM
> Subject: Re: painting floors
>
>
> >
>
> >
>
____________________________________________________________________________
> __
> > Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
> >
> > You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> > settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
> >
> > Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
> >
> > Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
> > www.audeostudios.com
> > "Carpe Argillam!!"
> >
> >
>
____________________________________________________________________________
> __
> > Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
> >
> > You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> > settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
> >
> > Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
> >
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
> Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
> www.audeostudios.com
> "Carpe Argillam!!"
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
> Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
> www.audeostudios.com
> "Carpe Argillam!!"
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
www.audeostudios.com
"Carpe Argillam!!"
John Jensen on tue 24 feb 04
I repaint my cement floors about once a year using acrylic house
paint...what you might call exterior latex. I hose them down regularly
and haven't ever noticed any slipperyness on the clean wet floor.
However, they are very slippery when covered with...Slip!
John Jensen, Mudbug Pottery
mudbug@toadhouse.com , http://www.toadhouse.com
logan johnson on tue 24 feb 04
Hey John,
You know what they say.... slip happens!
L .J .
John Jensen wrote:
I repaint my cement floors about once a year using acrylic house
paint...what you might call exterior latex. I hose them down regularly
and haven't ever noticed any slipperyness on the clean wet floor.
However, they are very slippery when covered with...Slip!
John Jensen, Mudbug Pottery
mudbug@toadhouse.com , http://www.toadhouse.com
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
www.audeostudios.com
"Carpe Argillam!!"
| |
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