Susan Fox-Hirschmann on fri 12 mar 04
Leo
you can get lots of comments here about us potters and our hand problems. My
best advise is to see a hand specialist. I have seen one for a "trigger
finger" issue
that cuases that middle finger to get locked down with other problems as well.
How anyone can diagnose you over the internet I do not know!?
See a specialist just to be sure!
best of luck
Susan
Annandale, VA
who has agreed not to practise medicine without a license!
Michele Jurist on fri 12 mar 04
Hi Leo:
If it's not too serious, like arthritis and is just inflammation, try emu
oil. Go to www. wonderoil.com. It reduces the swelling significantly.
Regards, Michele
----- Original Message -----
From: "leo"
To:
Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 6:16 PM
Subject: pain in the hands
> actually it's mostly in my thumb joint closest to my palm. it is most
painful when i hold something(like a paintbrush,coin, a trimming tool)
between my thumb and index finger. i was wondering if anyone has had a
similar problem and/or suggestions for relief. i am assuming the problem is
common among potter types and what better place to talk to those types than
here. thanks for any help anyone can offer.
> leo
>
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
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>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
Rikki Gill on fri 12 mar 04
Hi all,
I go to a hand therapist who does ultrasound treatments on my hands. It
isn't a cure, I am afraid, but it really helps. She also recommends warm
wax treatments, which feel really good, and ice. She would like me to use
splints, which I do at night, but not by day, and other things we really
can't use if we work.
My situation isn't ideal, but I can still work. Soft clay is good, too.
Al Sather on fri 12 mar 04
Greetings
I see several people have responded to this
post. I have these symptoms as well. They are
most aggravated while holding pots, or other
things. I am learning to open so as not to
stress my thumbs.
I have no answers, but replying only to be
another voice, and perhaps get a discussion
going.
I also have diagnosed osteoarthritis in my hips.
My Dr wanted to put me on one of the
osteoarthritis drugs to control pain and
inflammation. I chose not to. Maybe the pain is
not too severe, yet (yuck!).
I also did a workshop several years ago with Les
Manning from Medalta in Medicine Hat, Alberta.
When I follow what I learned from that workshop,
my hips do better. When I get tired, or lazy, my
hips tell me about it. If you have a chance to
attend one of his workshops, his part on
ergonomics is well worth the price of admission,
alone. Never no mind, he is also an excellent
potter, with many very good ideas.
Al Sather
Dogberry Clay Studio.
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG]
On Behalf Of leo
Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 6:17 PM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: [CLAYART] pain in the hands
actually it's mostly in my thumb joint closest
to my palm. it is most painful when i hold
something(like a paintbrush,coin, a trimming
tool) between my thumb and index finger. i was
wondering if anyone has had a similar problem
and/or suggestions for relief. i am assuming the
problem is common among potter types and what
better place to talk to those types than here.
thanks for any help anyone can offer.
leo
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less
spam
________________________________________________
______________________________
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Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be
reached at melpots@pclink.com.
Ann Brink on fri 12 mar 04
Cat Jarosz wrote:
> I am also going thru the pain in the thumb /palm and finally went to see
a
> doctor recently . Its a weird thing called DeQuervain's Disease. You can
find
> out more on surfing the web about it... I also get some numbness in the
> side of my hand ... I believe its from squeezing that slip trail bottle
over.......
Hi Cat, and Leo
About 8 years ago I was told my painful thumb area problem was called
DeQuervain's syndrome, or disease. The orthopedist had a way of bending the
thumb tip down, to check for it. He was getting ready to prescribe Naproxin
and I said "I haven't even tried aspirin yet" so he suggested trying no less
than 6 aspirins a day, 2 with each meal. He said you have to have that much
to get the antiinflammatory effect.
I did this for about 3 months and was cured. I also changed, very slightly,
the way I wedge. I keep very alert for any feeling of strain while wedging.
Of course, your problem could be entirely different, but if that's what you
have, it takes a while to heal.
Ann Brink in Lompoc CA
Laurie Kneppel on fri 12 mar 04
Hi Leo,
Do you find there is one spot that is more sore than the rest of the
joint area? Like a slittle lump? I get this in my thumbs and various
finger joints every once in awhile. One time my thumb was so sore I was
given a splint and told to take ibuprofen. Eventually my thumb went
from almost intolerable to perfectly fine again. I think it was
diagnosed as tendonitis. I had been doing a lot of sculpting but what
did it was playing bass guitar with an oldies rock band (we couldn't
find a bassist so i switched instruments). Being female and with little
short fingers, bass was a bit of a stretch for my left hand so voila!
tendonitis. It was my favorite sculpting thumb, too! I have had this
recur in other joints from time to time. My doctor (not the one who
prescribed the splint) recommended taking extra fish oil. Fish oil
(omega-3 fatty acids) has anti-inflammatory properties plus being good
for cholesterol issues. Doctor is a nutritional specialist so she knows
what she's talking about. So far my hands are still working!
Laurie
Sacramento, CA
On Mar 12, 2004, at 6:16 PM, leo wrote:
> actually it's mostly in my thumb joint closest to my palm. it is most
> painful when i hold something(like a paintbrush,coin, a trimming tool)
> between my thumb and index finger.
leo on fri 12 mar 04
actually it's mostly in my thumb joint closest to my palm. it is most painful when i hold something(like a paintbrush,coin, a trimming tool) between my thumb and index finger. i was wondering if anyone has had a similar problem and/or suggestions for relief. i am assuming the problem is common among potter types and what better place to talk to those types than here. thanks for any help anyone can offer.
leo
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Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam
gillian evison on fri 12 mar 04
Yes, I have the same thing, and am assuming that it is tendonitis ( an xray
showed no sign of arthritis). I have a brace which I can wear at night,
which helps - ibuprofen also helps - bottom line for any injury of this type
( repetetive injuries) is to stop doing whatever caused the trouble. Figure
that one out.
Regards, Jill in Vancouver, B.C.
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Charles Moore on fri 12 mar 04
Leo,
I am no expert at this sort of matter, but it sounds like you may have
osteoarthritis, which I have had for years. What happens is that the
connective tissue between the joints wears out.
What can be done? I take Vioxx (or Celebrex) to keep down the inflammation,
though some people do just as well with Ibuprofen (Motrin). In addition, I
have taken glucosamine and chondroitin (and MSM) for several years. Though
I still have occasional pain, I am able to continue potting.
How about addressing your questions to Dr. Tom Sawyer: tsawyer@cfl.rr.com,
who is a Clayart regular. Tom is always very helpful.
Charles Moore
Sacramento
----- Original Message -----
From: "leo"
To:
Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 6:16 PM
Subject: pain in the hands
> actually it's mostly in my thumb joint closest to my palm. it is most
painful when i hold something(like a paintbrush,coin, a trimming tool)
between my thumb and index finger. i was wondering if anyone has had a
similar problem and/or suggestions for relief. i am assuming the problem is
common among potter types and what better place to talk to those types than
here. thanks for any help anyone can offer.
> leo
>
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Cat Jarosz on sat 13 mar 04
Hey there Leo,
I am also going thru the pain in the thumb /palm and finally went to see a
doctor recently . Its a weird thing called DeQuervain's Disease. You can find
out more on surfing the web about it... I also get some numbness in the
side of my hand ... I believe its from squeezing that slip trail bottle over
and over and over as boy sometimes I hit the roof with pain when I squeeze ..
Treatment is Naproxen 500 mg 2x daily... lower dose didnt do much and
the 500 does help.. Naproxen is an anti inflammatory drug which is a fancy
name for a type of asprin good for inflamation. You can splint the thumb but
I dont see much help with it and it gets in the way of work... There really
isnt much that can be done other than those 2 things according to the doc I
have.
I am not really sure what the equivalent to Naproxen is in asprin
although I did find a brand at wally world ( wal mart) called equate naproxen
sodium ... I still have my prescription ones and have not tried these off brand
ones to see if they work yet. But I am sure there is a asprin out there on the
market similar enough to do the job cheaper than paying prescription prices
even with insurance.
ps its a painful disorder affecting the tendons at the base of the thumb.
a common kind of tendon lining inflammatory disease. Some type of lubrication
system failure that allows friction to develope between the tendon and the
sheeth its encased in. All the friction causes abnormal thickening and
constriction of the sheeth which in turn interferes with the smooth gliding motion
of the tendons. in other words OUCHIE !!!
Hope this helps but seeing your doc is best thing to do . warmest
regards, Cat in NC mountains .
Christy Pines on sat 13 mar 04
My cousin had terrible pain in her thumbs - until she took the cure. It worked for her
Soak golden raisins in gin.
Eat nine of them every morning.
Not eight, not ten, not vodka
christy in connecticut, dreaming of the paper and clay kiln that Richard Launder taught me to build and fire last weekend. now just waiting until I have a barrel full of slip with which to create one of my own.
snipped:
actually it's mostly in my thumb joint closest
to my palm. it is most painful when i hold
something(like a paintbrush,coin, a trimming
tool) between my thumb and index finger. i was
wondering if anyone has had a similar problem
and/or suggestions for relief.
Carole Fox on sat 13 mar 04
Yep- I am having similar problems. I can tell you a couple of things that
really bother it. One is trimming, holding the tool in a tight fisted hand
for long periods of time. The other is the computer -yes, unfortunately
Clayart is bad for my health. However, at this point, I'm so addicted that I
will figure out how to use the mouse with my toes, nose or even my teeth if
I have to.
My chiropractor has helped when things got really bad.
Carole Fox
Silver Fox Pottery
Elkton, MD
thesilverfox@dol.net
Snail Scott on sat 13 mar 04
At 12:38 AM 3/13/04 EST, you wrote:
> I am not really sure what the equivalent to Naproxen is in asprin
>although I did find a brand at wally world ( wal mart) called equate
naproxen
>sodium ... I still have my prescription...
Naproxen Sodium is not aspirin, but one of that
class of painkillers, called NSAIDs, which includes
ibuprofen, too. Over-the-counter naproxen sodium
is the same as the prescription, whether you get
a name brand like Aleve or a store-brand generic.
Many doctors don't keep up with what's available
over-the-counter, and also don't realize how
expensive prescriptions can be. The only reason to
keep using a prescription for an OTC drug is if your
insurance has high enough prescription benefits that
it's actually cheaper for you.
I'm not a doctor, nor do I play one on TV, but I do
know that doctors live in a world of drug company
advice, and often simply forget to mention OTC
options. Unless it's cheaper for you to keep the
prescription, ask your doctor if there's any reason
you can't just use the OTC version.
-Snail
Kathy Forer on sat 13 mar 04
Pain-handed people, be careful with aleve/naproxin! I've known two
"iron-stomached" people who developed stomach problems, one ulcers, the
other a hole in the intestine which required surgery. Apocryphal
perhaps, but there are many facts to substantiate repercussions from
over-use of pain-killers.
Kathy
Lori Leary on sat 13 mar 04
Take these meds with food or milk...taking NSAIDS like aleve/motrin on
an empty stomach is
a sure way to develop GI problems down the road. They are wonderful
drugs, but be careful..
Lori L.
...still a nurse no matter how many pots I make...
Kathy Forer wrote:
> Pain-handed people, be careful with aleve/naproxin! I've known two
> "iron-stomached" people who developed stomach problems, one ulcers, the
> other a hole in the intestine which required surgery. Apocryphal
> perhaps, but there are many facts to substantiate repercussions from
> over-use of pain-killers.
>
Edy Lynn on sat 13 mar 04
Heehee! Reminds me of a name some jokster used for his nurse at one time -
Carrie Potts
Sorry, had to come out.
BTW, I was going to the DR. like twice a month and tried Vioxx and
Celebrex much to the pain of my pocketbook as well as my joints. As my
medical insurance went away I started using generic Naproxen. Worked better
than the Rx stuff. Just make sure you eat breakfast first.
Warm Parafin works as a soother also. They have the appliances in discount
stores. It also soothes your dry skin. Weird but wonderful
Edy Lynn
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lori Leary"
To:
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 5:12 PM
Subject: Re: pain in the hands
> Take these meds with food or milk...taking NSAIDS like aleve/motrin on
> an empty stomach is
> a sure way to develop GI problems down the road. They are wonderful
> drugs, but be careful..
>
> Lori L.
> ...still a nurse no matter how many pots I make...
>
> Kathy Forer wrote:
>
> > Pain-handed people, be careful with aleve/naproxin! I've known two
> > "iron-stomached" people who developed stomach problems, one ulcers, the
> > other a hole in the intestine which required surgery. Apocryphal
> > perhaps, but there are many facts to substantiate repercussions from
> > over-use of pain-killers.
> >
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Lee Love on sat 13 mar 04
leo wrote:
>actually it's mostly in my thumb joint closest to my palm. it is most painful when i hold something(like a paintbrush,coin, a trimming tool) between my thumb and index finger. i was wondering if anyone has had a similar problem and/or suggestions for relief. i am assuming the problem is common among potter types and what better place to talk to those types than here. thanks for any help anyone can offer.
>
>
I did a number on my thumbs while building the kiln. "Brick
Mason's" thumbs? Couldn't use them to grasp. Was embarrassing
when Jean asked me to open a jar for her (had to develop the "thumbless
grip" technique for grasping (fingers to heel of palm.) Never built a
kiln before and I laid every brick by myself Was in a hurry, because
I had less than 3 months to build the kiln, do final tests on my glazes,
buy my glaze materials, mix large batches of glaze and equip, new racks
in the studio, before my graduation show.
After the show I let my hands rest. I think it is the only
remedy, but I also took aspirin and vitamin E.
--Lee In Mashiko Lee@Mashiko.org http://Mashiko.us "With Humans
it's what's here (he points to his heart) that makes the difference. If
you don't have it in the heart, nothing you make will make a
difference." ~~Bernard Leach~~ (As told to Dean Schwarz)
Kathy Forer on sat 13 mar 04
> Olive says "Balls". Not being offensive.
"Will you look at the man? He's a Freudian delight; he crawls with
clues!"
***********************
The Madness of Captain Queeg
written by Stanley Roberts, Michael Blankfort, from the novel by Herman
Wouk
(Captain Queeg removes the steel balls from his pocket and he spins
them in his palm insistently as he speaks.)
Queeg: No, I, I don't see any need of that. Now that I recall, he might
have said something about messboys and then again he might not -- I
questioned so many men and Harding was not the most reliable officer.
Lt. Greenwald (Jose Ferrer): I'm afraid the defense has no other
recourse than to produce Lt. Harding.
Queeg: Now there's no need for that I know exactly what hell tell you.
Lies! He was no different than any officer in the wardroom -- they were
all disloyal, I tried to run the ship properly by the book but they
fought me at every turn. If the crew wanted to walk around with their
shirttails hanging out that's all right let them take the tow line.
Defective equipment no more no less, but they encouraged the crew to go
around scoffing at me and spreading wild rumors about steaming and
circles. And then old yellow stain. I was to blame for Lt. Merrick's
incompetence and poor seamanship. Lt. Merrick was the perfect officer
but not Captain Queeg.
Ah, but the strawberries! That's where I had them. They laughed at me
and made jokes, but I proved beyond the shadow of a doubt, and with
geometric logic, that a duplicate key to the wardroom icebox did exist!
And I'd have produced that key if they hadn't pulled Caine out of
action! I-I-I know now they were only trying to protect some fellow
officer and!......(realizes he has been ranting, babbling)
Naturally, I can only cover these things from memory if I've left
anything out, why, just ask me specific questions and I'll be glad to
answer them...one-by-one...
***********************
Symbols
Queeg's Metal Balls - The two tiny metal balls that Captain Queeg
constantly rolls around between his fingers are a symbol of his mental
problems. The balls are like his security blanket, without which he
would fall apart. The balls make the captain's nervousness and
insecurity visible to the world. The turning point of the court martial
comes when Greenwald badgers Queeg to the point that Queeg has to take
out the balls to keep himself from falling apart.
Eleanora Eden on sun 14 mar 04
I have arthritis in my hands. My mom's hands were twisted like tree roots
the last 15 years of her life. So I do everything I know to help my
hands. I do glucosomine chondroitin, calcium magnesium, MSM, lots of
naproxin. My understanding from my MD is that 2 naproxin sodium generic is
equal to the Rx dose. Still the hands are getting worse more quickly now.
Is anybody doing acupuncture for it? I'm under the care of a
rheumatologist and that doesn't seem to mean alot in terms of actual therapies.
Eleanora
www.eleanoraeden.com
Charnley McCrorey on sun 14 mar 04
Hi all,
I have been a nurse twenty years and a sculptor a little longer. Thus below
is MHO and blow me off if this doesn't please you.
I gotta put in my two cents worth here.
1) Spend the money, go to a doc, get the blood work done and the Xrays. Get
an accurate diagnosis of what is wrong.
2) if it is Arthritis start looking into adaptive equipment. There are ways
to maintain your control of tools and still relieve pain.
if taking pills just doesn't do it for you, and it doesn't for me, there are
some cool tricks.
Cloth bags full of rice heated in the microwave for between 30 secs and 1.5
minutes eases the pain tremendously especially if you wrap it round about your
wrist and across the palm of your hand where it hurts. Braces work best if
worn at night to keep your hands in good position while sleeping. Kind of gives
them an enforced rest.
If you have insurance, a sports medicine Physical Therapist can do wonders
for helping you create and ergonomic work space and adaptive tools.
My favorites are figuring out how to attach things to hand braces. There are
a few neat tricks and velcro is your friend.
The best thing i found though, and it is expensive but 4 ounces lasts me a
few months is a cream that is compounded at a "Compounding Pharmacy" called
Ketocam. It is only available by perscription, it is expensive and it works
amazingly well if it is ordinary arthritis. If it is nerve damage or something
else then it might ease pain but it is not a long term mix.
If your interested in knowing more about it contact me off list and I will
let you know more.
Blessings
Charnley
Laughing Lion Productions
Making silly little dragons to make people smile
Ivor and Olive Lewis on sun 14 mar 04
Dear Friends,
Olive says "Balls". Not being offensive.
Go to your nearest "China Town" and get a set of Meditation Balls.
Pick a size which is comfortable in your hands and follow the
instructions. They help to strengthen small muscles and increase
mobility. Nice music as well. Good idea even if you suffer from no
afflictions in your hands.
So often we forget that ours is a very physical art.
If it were tennis players or gymnasts, golfers or into Ball sports we
would spend time on physical preparation, warm ups, stretches,
resistance training before stepping into the arena. Lots of things we
can do to prevent the onset of problems..
Wishing everyone a painless existence.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis. Redhill, South Australia
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rikki Gill"
To:
Sent: Saturday, 13 March 2004 4:09
Subject: Re: pain in the hands
> Hi all,
> I go to a hand therapist who does ultrasound treatments on my hands.
It
> isn't a cure, I am afraid, but it really helps. She also recommends
warm
> wax treatments, which feel really good, and ice. She would like me
to use
> splints, which I do at night, but not by day, and other things we
really
> can't use if we work.
>
> My situation isn't ideal, but I can still work. Soft clay is good,
too.
>
>
______________________________________________________________________
________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your
subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Rikki Gill on mon 15 mar 04
Elenora,
You might ask about ultra sound therapy. It helps me a lot, but for
swelling of the tendons. Fortunately, my health insurance covers most of
the cost.
Best , Rikki
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eleanora Eden"
To:
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:29 PM
Subject: pain in the hands
> I have arthritis in my hands. My mom's hands were twisted like tree roots
> the last 15 years of her life. So I do everything I know to help my
> hands. I do glucosomine chondroitin, calcium magnesium, MSM, lots of
> naproxin. My understanding from my MD is that 2 naproxin sodium generic
is
> equal to the Rx dose. Still the hands are getting worse more quickly now.
> Is anybody doing acupuncture for it? I'm under the care of a
> rheumatologist and that doesn't seem to mean alot in terms of actual
therapies.
>
> Eleanora
> www.eleanoraeden.com
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
Lois Ruben Aronow on mon 15 mar 04
> > I have arthritis in my hands. My mom's hands were twisted
> like tree roots the last 15 years of her life. So I do everything I know
to
> > help my hands. I do glucosomine chondroitin, calcium magnesium, MSM,
> > lots of naproxin. My understanding from my MD is that 2 naproxin
> > sodium generic is equal to the Rx dose. Still the hands are getting
worse
> >more quickly now.
> > Is anybody doing acupuncture for it? I'm under the care of a
> > rheumatologist and that doesn't seem to mean alot in terms of actual
> therapies.
I am doing acupuncture for some chronic nagging back pain. I checked myself
out with western medicine - I have a compression between by L4 and L5, with
no apparent disc degeneration. I chose not to go the medication route, as I
often find that, for me, I'm trading pain for side effects.
The acupuncture is nothing short of a miracle for me. My acupuncturist said
she can make the pain go away, but I have to keep it away - back exercises,
weight loss, etc. But all that stuff is so much easier to do without the
pain. Added bonus: I have tons of energy after my acuncture session.
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