mel jacobson on sun 2 may 04
in my view, the entire story of water, wet, dry,
lots, none, distilled, acid laden or whatever is about:
HOW LONG are your pots on the wheel?
if you are messin about for thirty minutes with one
pot....you have trouble anyway.
if you get after the throwing, and take a minute or two, who
cares how much water you use. how long should it take to
throw a mug? two minutes...it is a tube of clay.
it is about clay sucking up water while on the wheel.
i use water, clean water, (or dirty after an hour) but i never have a pot
on the
wheel more than two minutes...and it is sponged dry
and set to dry. even large pieces are on no more than 4 minutes.
a great production thrower will make between 28-50 pots
an hour. (depending on size and shape.) and the pots
barely get wet. clay on, center, shape, refine, off.
the reason folks have trouble is that they mess with the
pot for twenty minutes. SOAKED THROUGH, ALL THE INTEGRITY
OF THE CLAY IS LOST.
so what i have told old acidic bottom dolita....get after
your work. throw many, in a short time....learn to get
after it. staring out the window, doing yoga thought and
wandering around in your brain does not get pots done.
it is work...and should be a bit speedy.
(don't start howling...`i love to play, think deep thoughts,
it is my time to get away.) if that is why you make pots,
then it is going to be difficult to get work done, and pots
that do not collapse. if that is what you want, so be it. that
is choice.
but, throwing and clay has a great deal to do with physics
and chemistry. you abuse it, and it does not work.
throwing on the wheel is a very direct activity. the clay has
only so many minutes that it will actually support itself...we cannot
alter that fact. the more water you use, the longer it takes the
more trouble you will have. that is a fact.
folks that work all day with clay will more than tell you how.
but, many do not listen.
this is not a post about how good one is, or what the pots
look like, or being better than others.
it is about discipline and work.
design, shapes, figuring out what your pots look like could
easily be done with paper and pencil. if you know how to
throw. the confusion comes with people who do not control
the clay, and HOPE for a `prettygoodshape`.
if you know how to control your clay and wheel, you decide
before you climb on board.
it would be like an architect that designs the house as it
is being built. `no, no, put the kitchen here, no....here,
no, take that wall down...take down those pipes, put it here.`
there seems to be an attitude that having skill and knowledge
will somehow destroy creativity. sorry, but in my opinion not
having skill and clay knowledge destroys your ability to create
whatever you want.
it would be like telling a fine furniture maker to not worry
about how a saw works, or how the machines function...`just
throw the wood on the floor and kick it around, a table is
bound to appear`.
or a silver smith should not understand solder, and heat.
`fake it, a ring will appear`.
a potter should be able to sit down at a wheel and
crank out any standard mug shape in minutes. hundreds
of them in a day. it is often our own perception of what
making pots is all about that holds us back.
if your limit is 5 pots a day,
don't plan on making your profit/loss statement work.
and, many do not care. if that is the case, have a great
time...use your studio time as a therapy session. if it works
for you...fine with me. but, do not knock skill and discipline,
for, that is the history of crafts people.
mel
read david hendley's story in cm this month..read it, don't
just look at the pictures. it is what he does...makes lots
of pots. he is a knowledgeable potter, and a great one.
read tom turners story of porcelain. a true pros quest
for quality. good stuff.
From:
Minnetonka, Minnesota, U.S.A.
web site: my.pclink.com/~melpots
or try: http://www.pclink.com/melpots
new/ http://www.rid-a-tick.com
Don Kopyscinski on sun 2 may 04
Mel's thoughts on this are right on. There is no need to putter endlessly
while making a pot.
I would like to add the following. When throwing larger pieces or taking a
little extra time to refine a form, the clay does not need to get very soft.
The judicious use of a rib after each pull will clean the surface of a lot of
water or slip that is clinging to the pot. In this way it allows you to throw a
bit thinner, without the risk of the pot slumping under it's own weight. It's
a matter of personal preference, but cleaning the surface with the
appropriately shaped rib becomes second nature. Sometimes a final shaping pull can be
done pushing against the rib which is being held in the outside hand at a slight
angle away from the pot. In this way, you are pressing against a small surface
area of a smooth hard surface and perhaps getting a little edge against
gravity.
When I throw I have the following available:
Throwing water (pH adjusted if needed....not really. I like the feel of water
better than slip but it's a personal preference)
One shaping rib, chosen based on the size and shape of the form. Not always
used on smaller forms. This may also be used to compress the inside a bit and
push any grog that has become exposed to the surface to be pushed back below
the surface.
A Sponge for dripping a little water on the rim of the pot so it cascades
down to meet my rising hands.
A chamois, for smoothing rims.
A sponge on a stick for cleaning water out of the inside of bottle forms and
taller pots.
A cleanup trimming rib (the long ones with a sharpened point) for sweeping
away the excess clay at the base of the piece as a last step to eliminate all or
most trimming.
A twisted wire cutoff wire (twisted wire the right size causes the pot to
separate from the bat nicely, and not then reattach itself to the thin clay pad
left on the bat.
Most anything else is superfluous and just gets in the way. Some specialty
tools such as throwing sticks for certain bottle forms or a decorating tool are
the exceptions.
sdr on sun 2 may 04
Mel said:
> there seems to be an attitude that having skill and knowledge
> will somehow destroy creativity. sorry, but in my opinion not
> having skill and clay knowledge destroys your ability to create
> whatever you want.........
Technique and idea are mutually supportive in any work. Any.
So don't get hurt feelings and start a screaming/pouting match
because Mel stated the obvious in his direct, no-nonsense way.
And do read David Hendley's article. It's a pleasure. And
instructive.
regards
Dannon Rhudy
>
John Hesselberth on mon 3 may 04
On Sunday, May 2, 2004, at 10:34 AM, mel jacobson wrote:
> there seems to be an attitude that having skill and knowledge
> will somehow destroy creativity.
Hi Mel,
I like the statement that 'skill and knowledge enable creativity'. They
don't assure it, but you cannot fully develop your creative capability
without the skill and knowledge to enable it.
Your statement above is exactly why we see so much crap being made from
people who think they are being 'creative'. They refuse to acquire the
necessary skills and knowledge because they think it will confine them.
As they used to say on Laugh In -- Bullfeathers!
Regards,
John
John Hesselberth
http://www.frogpondpottery.com
http://www.masteringglazes.com
John Jensen on mon 3 may 04
There's an old saying among engineers in Louisiana that "when you're up
to your ass in alligators, it's hard to remember that your original goal
was to drain the swamp."
One of my art mentors used to say that an artist was someone who
survived his/her art education.
I think oftentimes when we set out to study a discipline of art we are
under a gentle spell of the possibilities of creative life, and in fact
the rigors of learning the hard lessons of our discipline can put our
suitability for that life to the test. Gaining the skill and knowledge
to be able to full express artistic inclination can and often does
destroy the original creative urge. People can become wrapped up in
technique, knowledge, materials, and so forth. As the joke says, "Art
for the sake of using art materials."
It's a risk we all have to take if we want to be artists. We have to
risk losing our original inspiration and be open to discovering new
sources of inspiration as we go through the very difficult task of
learning our medium.
John Jensen, Mudbug Pottery
mudbug@toadhouse.com , http://www.toadhouse.com
On Sunday, May 2, 2004, at 10:34 AM, mel jacobson wrote:
> there seems to be an attitude that having skill and knowledge
> will somehow destroy creativity.
Hi Mel,
I like the statement that 'skill and knowledge enable creativity'. They
don't assure it, but you cannot fully develop your creative capability
without the skill and knowledge to enable it.
wayneinkeywest on mon 3 may 04
John:
May I borrow the quote below?
I want to carve it into porcelain,
fire it, and hang it in the studio.
Best,
Wayne Seidl
Key West, Florida, USA
North America, Terra
Latitude 81.8, Longitude 24.4
Elevation 3.1 feet (1m)
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Jensen"
To:
Sent: Monday, May 03, 2004 8:50 AM
Subject: Re: water and throwing/discipline
snip
> It's a risk we all have to take if we want to be artists. We
have to
> risk losing our original inspiration and be open to discovering
new
> sources of inspiration as we go through the very difficult task of
> learning our medium.
>
>
>
> John Jensen, Mudbug Pottery
Ivor and Olive Lewis on mon 3 may 04
Mel is right.
If clay is of the true consistency for throwing then beyond the
initial stage of centring there is no need to add any more lubricant.
Well prepared clay contains sufficient water to lubricate your hands
and finger tips.
How many people who throw clay realise that?
Remember, it's your hands that have to be lubricated because they dry
out and induce a lot of drag.
As Lili says, and as I have written many times, Throw Dry ! !
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis. Redhill, South Australia
Betsy Price/Tom Wirt on tue 4 may 04
Take a minute and look at what's happening to the water when you throw.
Standing still, the clay absorbs almost no water. Only when you are moving
the clay is water absorbed. You can let the water sit in the bottom for 15
minutes...half hour...who knows. But it isn't doing any damage. Don't
believe this...run the tests for yourself.
Tom Wirt
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