Sheryl VanVleck-Wells on tue 12 oct 04
I am just rejoining Clayart after a year hiatus. Sheryl of Wyoming is =
now Sheryl of "Back Home Again in Indiana". I am now a "studio owning, =
exhibiting to the public, do I have to do chataquas (the new term I =
am hearing for art fairs), starving artist". (does the period really go =
on the outside of quotes?) So I have a few comments and a question.
I have spent the past year remodeling a horse barn for a studio, getting =
acquainted with the local artists/art guilds and working my behind off =
to create "enough" work to fill my studio. Which never happens. As =
with most things I fear I am a day behind (in this case behind the 80s =
when work was selling apparently). Those art fairs are getting hard on =
a 56 year old and now I have pottery to deal with and not just damaged =
frames. I do know that Christopher Reeves life and death and my earning =
a living from art is one of those apples and oranges conversations. =
Some of my art is based on social issues (endangered species mostly) and =
I know that I, alone, will never be the sole reason endangerment of some =
animal stops, but if I can raise the consciousness of one child (they =
are very much attracted to my work) then I will also, as an artist, =
contribute something to the world. Even just the laughs I get on my =
work (I do cringe a bit when my animals on pots are so often referred to =
as whimsical) can help someone forget the bad time they are having in =
life. So, I feel that I do contribute to the community. The arts are =
very important here and so, as I fill out my grant application (my =
first) for a new roof I will not feel one shred of guilt. What I will =
feel is great relief at the possibility of not tripping over 16 =
rubbermaids (various sizes) catching leaks every time it rains. =20
I did art fairs with my two dimensional work for many years. It was =
often the work I told my husband not to mat or that I started throwing =
out and he saved that went first. Think of George Orr, the Mad Potter =
of Biloxi. He knew that people needed relief in life. They don't need =
perfectly drawn "animals, plants". They can see that in real life every =
day. They want to laugh. They want to have an object that brings joy =
to their lives. Joyce: instead of struggling, how about relaxing and =
seeing if you can't make those pots into something you are proud of too. =
Work with that idea first and the craftsmanship will follow.
Now for balancing the joy in my work and the need to make a living, I =
have a question. I think I already know the answer to this but want =
that "one last opinion" before I make the final decision I worked as an =
adjunct for a while and loved it. I do not have health insurance, am =
worried about building social security up and also about having a living =
should I suddenly be on my own (my husband is disabled). BUT, if I go =
back for my Masters will anyone hire a 60 year old new professor? =
That's with the three years masters program. I could be a full time =
student so that's not the problem. Having a large student loan is =
though, especially for no end pay off. What is the hiring situation and =
don't tell me it's illegal to discriminate on the basis of age. I want =
to know what "really" happens.
I sit here leaning over the dictionary; it will be the last time for =
that. Sorry, I used to be able to spell but seem to be losing that =
ability. Just not important enough, I guess, in a life filled with a =
child going off to college, trying to earn a living in the studio, a =
mother in my home and an ill husband. Yes, there are many things more =
important than other things, which are more important than yet other =
things.
Sheryl VanVleck of Brown County, Indiana
Where the leaves are falling fast and the customers wend down the 400 ' =
driveway looking for a working artist. We have a promoted fall tour =
here with twelve artists who have open, working studios/galleries for =
the month of October.
Sheryl A. VanVleck
VanVleck Studio
7873 N. Oak Ridge Road
Morgantown, IN 46410
www.VanVleckStudio.com Excuse this =
site, it needs to be updated BAD or is that BADLY
Stephani Stephenson on tue 12 oct 04
Sheryl asked
"BUT, if I go back for my Masters will anyone hire a 60 year old new
professor?"
Sheryl
in a word,
no
I know
this is painted with a very broad brush
there is a scene in the movie 'Dumb and Dumber"
where Jim Carrey's character is asking the woman he's infatuated with
what the chances are of them getting together
she says something like
"About one in two million"
he says
"Then you're telling me there's a chance! yippee!!!"
(In the movie I think they do get together, but that is the movies.)
I'm not down on optimism, and am certainly one for considering all
options.
if you love to teach I mean really love to teach you'll find a way to
teach
If you want to get a masters for the learning or any number of personal
reasons, then go for it! get a masters degree. If you want to continue
your work with art or animals, then give it your all, there are
additional ways besides the art fairs.
but if you hop, hop , hop down the ' first I will get an MFA, then I'll
teach' bunny trail
the overwhelming likelihood is you will be 'not selected'
at 60, at 50 , even at 40
it will be no, no, no , no thank you, thank you for applying but no.
will a reason be given? no.
before there's a howl, I know there are probably exceptions.
But I am offering my 'no'
to interject a sense of
bald faced reality.
(I also think that if you really really want to do this
someone saying 'no" will just spur you on
that's one way to gauge your determination
if you are determined, motivated and tenacious, you'll do it anyway!
if not, then don't pin your hopes on it)
Stephani Stephenson
steph@revivaltileworks.com
http://www.revivaltileworks.com
clennell on tue 12 oct 04
Stephani wrote:
> Sheryl asked
> "BUT, if I go back for my Masters will anyone hire a 60 year old new
> professor?"
>
> Sheryl
> in a word,
>
> no
>
> I know
> this is painted with a very broad brush
> there is a scene in the movie 'Dumb and Dumber"
> where Jim Carrey's character is asking the woman he's infatuated with
> what the chances are of them getting together
Sheryl; last year in November i had a Joyce bad month. Feeling very
depressed about my life as a potter. No pension, no savings, worried about
how hard my bride works, blah, blah, very boring. I e-mailed my friend Ron
Meyers in Georgia to say i wanted to go to the U of G to get my MFA so that
sheila and I could live the next 15 years of our life in relative comfort.
ron e-mailed back and said this
Tony-
Pour yourself a double bourbon and go to bed. You have the flu. Besides you
ought to be a prof anyway.
Luv,
Ron
P.S Who the hell would hire you anyway.
I have a part time gig at a great school. I went to bed at 8 on a Saturday
night. I'm pooped. i ain't 26 anymore and can't give them 18 hour days which
is what i think I would if I were 26 again. of course, I'd probably divorce
shortly thereafter.
So Cheryl here's my advice- do you like Maker's Mark, Knob Creek, Jim Beam,
Jack Daniels or Rebel Yell.???
I know what you're thinking. I've thought it myself.
You're not alone out there.
Cheers,
Tony
Tony and Sheila Clennell
Sour Cherry Pottery
4545 King Street
Beamsville, Ontario
CANADA L0R 1B1
http://www.sourcherrypottery.com
Kate Johnson on tue 12 oct 04
> I have a part time gig at a great school. I went to bed at 8 on a Saturday
> night. I'm pooped. i ain't 26 anymore and can't give them 18 hour days
> which
> is what i think I would if I were 26 again. of course, I'd probably
> divorce
> shortly thereafter.
> So Cheryl here's my advice- do you like Maker's Mark, Knob Creek, Jim
> Beam,
> Jack Daniels or Rebel Yell.???
> I know what you're thinking. I've thought it myself.
> You're not alone out there.
Dear God, I hope rum or Scotch works as well...I don't like bourbon.
Best--
Kate
Dorothy Feibleman on wed 13 oct 04
Dear All,
If you want to do something, it is still possible in the USA. Will you
always be questioning as each year goes by should I or why didn`t I? If you
can afford to do it, and you believe you would be a damn good teacher,
consider , consider each degree as a new challenge and exploration and
addition to your gray matter. Think about the job later but you could
always pull the age descriminationcard. You may find after a Masters, you
have changed your mind or have made different connections and you might do
something totally different than you had thought when you started.
My sister, who got a BFA at RISD for Ceramics in about 1969 or so, had
always wanted to be a doctor.
She had two kids in her early 20s and they were in high school and
university when I got the call.
When she was 38, she called me up and said she was thinking of studying
food science.
I said forget that, you have one chance only and always wanted to be a
doctor, so if you are going to go back to University, you better go for
Medical School and become a surgeon.
Her kids helped her study calc. , physics , and how to use the
computer---remember she was a potter, housewife and also earned money doing
illustrations for advertising----She had not studied these things for a
ceramics degree. She entered Brown Medical School at the same time her
first son was there in undergraduate.
She graduated in the top 1% in the US and then went into residence--she
made a study book for her fellow students which was visual. It helped make
memorable visual links for those who think in 3d rather than in a linear
way. She realised that although she was excellent in surgery, (she was very
interested in reconstructive surgery for children) that as an older woman,
she would be fighting the system (and all those 2D males who are good at
the system but not very adept at cutting people up--my reading on the
situation) for too many years still qualifying to be a surgeon. She decided
she preferred to have more regular hours and decided to be a GP. She also
likes her husband and wanted to see him sometime too, so, although she did
2 years residency in another state, coming home on weekends and making, and
bagging up homemade food for her husband and son living at home ETC....
It is hard, you need moral support from your family if you have one, you
have to be driven and have a dream.
She now has a practice of atleast 1000 clients (last time I asked) and she
still works extrememly hard and loves her job.
I think she does go to sleep about 9pm, but she gets up at 5 and runs with
her dogs most mornings, eats a big breakfast and drives into Providence
from her house on the coast--takes about 1hr.
In what other country would one have the option--she did have to fight for
it since she was a potter , a woman, and 38, wanting to become a doctor by
studying at the local U, which happened to be Brown University, but, these
things are still possible in the US where as this sort of thing would be
impossible to do in Europe.
(I am American but I live in Japan and England-and yes, I totally support
myself with my pots-no extras// I do sometimes design things for industry,
but that is still ceramics--I do like being thrown in the deep end with
weights and having to swim to the surface and get out, get on the diving
board and do a fancy dive and get out again--remember, I was born in the
States, and I like challenging myself)
Unless you believe you will be reincarnated as a human, and have a second
chance, it is better to die trying to achieve your dreams than retire into
depression or drinking and wondering "what if".
If you are tired, it isn`t always from working, it can be from a medical
problem or due to being overweight or not doing healthy energy building
exercise. Consider these things.
A drink can be nice to some people sometimes but it is not a solution. I
know "have a drink" always seems to be the cool throw away line in America
and England, but it sounds like you are not actually looking at the total
situaltion to me. Although, I do make damn gorgeous sakazuki (sake cups)
and wish for people to enjoy using them-- that is a different kind of
drinking--different reason.
Don`t have a drink, go swimming, or go running or if you want to build
yourself up in a non-aerobic way do pilades if you can afford it. It does
give you more strength and energy. To find the best pilades studio, call
your local ballet company and ask where they go. They are always having
injuries and do pilades to compensate and always go to the best pilades
people. Before they sold pilades machines, I made myself a wooden folding
one to take to Japan in 1993. I had been run over by a motorbike and had
loads of physio to regain the use of my right arm and was recommended
pilades by the Royal Ballet ortho. surgeon`s physiotherapist. It is good
for throwers backs to do it.--only a suggestion as it was a life saver for
me.
Think about altering something in your life now so you can put one foot
infront of the other not slump back on the couch with booze and fall asleep
infront of the TV. Get rid of the TV while you are at it. Threw mine out of
the window 20 years ago---best choice I ever made. The Financial Times news
paper (London/Intl.) is much more informative than CNN anyway. Haven`t read
the Wall Street Journal for a while, so do not know if that is still a good
substitute any more. Lucie Rie used to wrap her pots in the Financial
times and I was delighted to know we read the same newspaper. I used to go
to her house sometimes for tea and her cake or rock cakes or dinner, but we
didn`t talk about pots so much as Hungarian food and our explorer
grandfathers. Yes, I am not 28 either.
Please re-think the whole situation and then jump in anyway but prepare
first for the jump. Check to make sure you are not tired because you might
be diabetic or something like that. It could be something simple. Go for a
physical, make sure you are well.
I always made fun of the cheerleaders, forgive me for getting out the
fluffy things they wave around and junping up and down---Gambat=E9 ,
Dorothy
Annette Frank on wed 13 oct 04
Sheryl, - just have a story to tell about old professors. Back in the
early 60' s I was attending Hunter College in New York, while working
full time as a librarian. I figured I give myself a freeby and take a
German course, a language I (thought) spoke. The professor was a Dr.
Lange totally unknow to any of us.
In blew a 5'2" wild woman with wiry gray hair. She energetically pointed
to various students. YOU: write this on the blackboard! YOU: give a copy
of this to everyone. YOU: push the chairs to a horseshoe. Then she
proceeded to open all the windows and without any further ado plunged
into a lecture on, believe it or not, Richard Wagner.
She was amazing. As we later found out, she has just gotten her PhD, at
age 64, this was her first teaching job and she worked us so hard, that
we actually admitted to emerge from that class with more knowledge, than
we went in.
This is just my experience I wanted to share with you
Annette Frank
>
>
Lori Leary on thu 14 oct 04
Sheryl,
I started working on my MFA two years ago at the ripe old age of 44.
With an undergrad degree in nursing and little formal art education, I
was worried if I was up to the challenge. I will finish this coming
spring and will have my thesis exhibition in the fall of 2005. All I
can say is that this has been a tremendously gratifying and wonderful
experience. It HAS been hard juggling life as a student, mom, wife
and nurse...but I do not regret a minute of it. I have learned so much
about myself and the world around me. Graduate school has been a joy;
working intensively in clay and having the opportunity to learn all
kinds of interesting things too: metals, art history, sculpture,
printmaking. I love being around other students, most of whom are
younger than me, but we manage to have fun and learn from each other.
As for teaching, I would love to get a teaching job...I love to teach
(have taught community clay classes and nursing related classes) and I
have a knack for it. It will be interesting to see how things work out,
but I have no illusions. There are lots of MFA's out there looking for
jobs....but that won't stop me from trying.
There are lots of scholarships and grants out there. Fastweb.com (
http://fastweb.monster.com )
is a good resource. I was able to get a scholarship from my school to
help pay my way, and I have managed to not rely on student loans.
Having your MFA may not necessarily lead toward a teaching position,
but if the process is approached as a life-enriching experience, you
stand to gain so much.
Best of luck,
Lori L.
Louis Katz on fri 15 oct 04
We can accept people without degrees in art. Most require some
undergraduate hours in art, usually upper division level (junior
senior).
I have a cousin who got a Masters in math without any undergraduate
degree at all. Schools have different policies although as accrediting
organizations get all their policies aligned differences are
vanishing. Check out some school's catalogs.
Louis
Texas A&M -CC
> It is quite common for people to enter an MFA program without an
> undergraduate art degree, but they still need to have a very strong
> portfolio.
Louis Katz
WIKI site http://www.tamucc.edu/wiki/Katz/HomePage
Ivor and Olive Lewis on fri 15 oct 04
Dear Lori,
Are you telling us that an arts degree of some description is not a
requirement for entry into an MFA program, that any pass degree is
satisfactory and formal arts experience is unnecessary?
By the way, I wish you a stunningly successful conclusion to your
period of study.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis.
Redhill,
S. Australia.
Lori Leary on fri 15 oct 04
Hi Ivor,
Thanks for your good wishes. As for the MFA, it's helpful to have a
prior arts degree, and many schools would probably not have even give
me a second glance because of my lack of one. But I have had lots of
informal clay instruction, learning from the best by hosting workshops
by such greats as our mel, Dannon, Doug Gray, Paul Lewing, Steve
Branfman, Vince Pitelka, Lili Krakowski, Russel Fouts, and Harvey
Sadow. I had a pretty decent portfolio and managed to talk my
professor into giving me a chance. Which just goes to show, you never
know unless you try.
Best wishes,
Lori
Ivor and Olive Lewis wrote:
>Dear Lori,
>Are you telling us that an arts degree of some description is not a
>requirement for entry into an MFA program, that any pass degree is
>satisfactory and formal arts experience is unnecessary?
>By the way, I wish you a stunningly successful conclusion to your
>period of study.
>Best regards,
>Ivor Lewis.
>Redhill,
>S. Australia.
>
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>
>
>
>
Vince Pitelka on fri 15 oct 04
> Are you telling us that an arts degree of some description is not a
> requirement for entry into an MFA program, that any pass degree is
> satisfactory and formal arts experience is unnecessary?
It is quite common for people to enter an MFA program without an
undergraduate art degree, but they still need to have a very strong
portfolio. People who are admitted without an art degree usually have a lot
of life experience and maturity, and are easily able to "catch up" with
those youngsters right out of BFA programs. And then, as in Lori's case,
they zoom ahead and are generally the leaders in the MFA program. Life
experience is so important in art, and MFA programs are looking for the
people who will make the best artists and teachers. Whether or not they
have an undergraduate art degree is just one consideration.
Best wishes -
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft, Tennessee Technological University
Smithville TN 37166, 615/597-6801 x111
vpitelka@dtccom.net, wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka/
http://www.tntech.edu/craftcenter/
Ivor and Olive Lewis on sat 16 oct 04
Thanks for that explanation Lori.
I have known people who have been accepted into undergraduate courses
in spite of not having the prerequisites for University Entrance. They
made their presence known by having superb portfolios and making a
strong impression at interview. Some Universities assist mature
students who have not completed a high school education to enter via
"Bridging' courses. As they say, " where there's a will....."
Glad that you could get acceptance in a similar fashion.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis.
Redhill,
S. Australia.
Edouard Bastarache Inc. on sat 16 oct 04
Lee,
" Don't have an undergrad art degree,"
Judging from the quality of your pieces I have here,
you do not need an undergraduate art degree.
Later,
"Ils sont fous ces quebecois"
Edouard Bastarache
Irreductible Quebecois
Indomitable Quebeker
Sorel-Tracy
Quebec
edouardb@sorel-tracy.qc.ca
www.sorel-tracy.qc.ca/~edouardb/Welcome.html
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/smart2000/index.htm
http://www.digitalfire.com/education/toxicity/
Lori Leary on sat 16 oct 04
mel,Vince, and Kelly,
Thanks for the kind words. Watch out that I don't develop the BIG
HEAD! If anyone sees me having trouble walking through doors at NCECA
this year, be sure to set me straight!
Clayart is and Clayarters are the best!
Yay for all of us, no matter our life choices.
Lori L.
>
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