mel jacobson on sat 27 aug 05
what do you tell folks?
`i am a person that uses a stick with hair and smear color around on cloth`.
why is so special to be an artist?
plumber
engineer
attorney
accountant
carpenter
artist
bricklayer
they are occupations. life styles.
is there some sort of romantic notion that
artist is better, more romantic, more interesting???
i think not.
if you do not believe that you are an artist, how can you be one.
if you cannot even call yourself a potter, how can you claim to be one. ????
it is like being on a plane...the guy next to you says...`what do you do?`
i say...`oh, i am an artist.` they say.
`that's nice.`
so what?
are they suppose to fall into the isle..scream at the sky and say.
`god, i am sitting next to an acclaimed artist.`
in most cases...they could care less...probably think i am a silly
jerk...move closer to the window. think i have a sexual disease that can
transfer to them.
in most cases people say the same thing.
`oh, i cannot draw a stick man.`
in my view, the only thing that matters is what my fellow artists
think of my work and my ethics. i care what bob anderson thinks,
kurt, doug gray and dannon and many others
....i care what joe koons thinks. i want them to think
that i am working hard and making progress. i care what my customers think.
they are the ones that lay down the bucks.
read the book `the meadow` (galvin)...i got it from heidi haugen.
a great read....and a thinking time. artist/craftsman/builder of stuff.
in fact...i cannot help myself...that is what i do.
(god, i hope no one ever finds out what i do. shhhh, keep it a secret)
i will sign my name
al, from wisconsin then, no one will know.
from mel/minnetonka.mn.usa
website: http://www.pclink.com/melpots
http://home.comcast.net/~figglywig/clayart.htm
for gail's year book.
URL Krueger on sat 27 aug 05
On Saturday 27 August 2005 12:25 pm, mel jacobson wrote:
> (god, i hope no one ever finds out what i do. shhhh,
> keep it a secret) i will sign my name
> al, from wisconsin then, no one will know.
al, from wisconsin ???
AL, from WISCONSIN???
If you use that everyone will see right through you
and know who you are immediately.
Everyone knows there are no Al's in wisconsin.
Only Sven's and Gustav's.
--
--
Earl K...
Bothell WA, USA
Vince Pitelka on sat 27 aug 05
> why is so special to be an artist?
> plumber
> engineer
> attorney
> accountant
> carpenter
> artist
> bricklayer
> they are occupations. life styles.
Exactly. I appreciate what Lili wrote, but that is just one interpretation
of the word "artist" - like "She's a real artist in the garden." As I see
it, an artist is just someone who makes art, and there is no qualitative
judgement there. The art might be crappy, but the maker is still an artist.
Making the word "artist" something high and mighty just prolonges the
separation that exists in our society between artists and everyone else, and
between art and the realities of everyday life. Art-making should be a
natural part of life. As I have said ad-nauseum on this list, every child
starts out as an artist - making art in a very intuitive, natural fashion.
If they were encouraged to continue this as they grew older, they would gain
skill and sensibility in the arts, and our society would be filled with
artists. The world would be a MUCH better place.
An artist is just someone who makes art, plain and simple, and art is just
visual expression, plain and simple, with no qualitative judgement implied.
There are good and great artists, but the word "artist" does not imply good
or great.
- Vince
Vince Pitelka
Appalachian Center for Craft, Tennessee Technological University
Smithville TN 37166, 615/597-6801 x111
vpitelka@dtccom.net, wpitelka@tntech.edu
http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka/
http://www.tntech.edu/craftcenter/
Kathy Forer on sun 28 aug 05
On Aug 27, 2005, at 7:13 PM, Vince Pitelka wrote:
> An artist is just someone who makes art, plain and simple, and art is
> just
> visual expression, plain and simple, with no qualitative judgement
> implied.
Back when I tentatively proclaimed I wanted to 'be' an artist, one of
my favorite people, a lively denizen of "the art world" and friend to
artists, asked me "why on earth would you want to 'do' that?" And then
stared rather purposefully, provocatively at me. The only answer I had
was "I like to make stuff." But it turns out that pretty much covers
it.
A few months ago a graphic in a newspaper study of class and income
mobility in America, "Class in America: Shadowy Lines That Still
Divide" NYTimes 05/15/2005, http://tinyurl.com/764f8 explored prestige
and respect as awarded to various occupations (also education, income
and wealth). "Artists and Related Workers" were slightly above the
median along with film makers, writers, photographers and designers;
police, firefighters, farmers and managers. Computer tech people (hello
geeks), legal, medical, educational and engineering led the pack, with
food, service, caring, maintenance and manual labor holding down the
bottom.
Pride is a funny thing for an artist, as powerful a force as for a
politician, but in a different way. Few other things that people do are
so involved with vanity, so apparently worthless or futile. The
constructs necessary to sustain any self-reflexive activity can get
pretty complicated. Potters can thankfully let a peach, coffee or
flowers grace and inhabit their work, their products, and get around
the paradox of conceit.
Intrinsic value of a thing can be referenced by the materials or craft
involved. Any extrinsic value of art presupposes other benefits and is
kind of parasitic. We may need art culturally and individually,
publicly and privately, but it's a non-essential commodity. The only
way I see around this humility-dissolving superfluous insufficiency,
because the clay stuff of my sculpture doesn't hold any water, is to do
it to please myself, make it a theoretical caprice, an intentional
whim, or a haphazard venomous pride.
Unfortunately, like al from wisconsin, I don't much care what other
people think of what I do. But then again I really do. I care what the
people in the quartile of my quantile think, see and know.
But while non-judgmental thoughts and ideas are reference, embodiment
and relation, thoughts about how pots and artists appear and approval
of those who look down at what we do, or up, or shiftily sideways have
little value, serve little purpose but to remind one of appearance,
position and place and ultimately of vanity, ostracism and alienation.
And say little of anything but the speaker's own pride. Some attitudes
toward art and artists can speak curiously and sadly of deprivation.
Many responses can be refreshing. Some can be vaguely uninteresting and
some beneath one's dignity; others demand we stand on our dignity and
right. Lazy or despicable and cowardly personal attacks intending to
demean and harm cause us to re-enlist, to affiliate and defend our
percentile. To identify and self-proclaim.
Random acts of bravado and measured responses in a range from legal to
housekeeping remind us all that Artists and Related Workers have a
broad outlook from our perch smack in the middle of society.
-- R. Mutt
We are therefore I do. now and then. K. Forer
fiona wallace on sun 28 aug 05
the only way it matters to me is that more respect/prestige usually means a better income; less worry about financial survival means more time to concentrate on the art.
Fiona.
Kathy Forer wrote:
On Aug 27, 2005, at 7:13 PM, Vince Pitelka wrote:
> An artist is just someone who makes art, plain and simple, and art is
> just
> visual expression, plain and simple, with no qualitative judgement
> implied.
Back when I tentatively proclaimed I wanted to 'be' an artist, one of
my favorite people, a lively denizen of "the art world" and friend to
artists, asked me "why on earth would you want to 'do' that?" And then
stared rather purposefully, provocatively at me. The only answer I had
was "I like to make stuff." But it turns out that pretty much covers
it.
A few months ago a graphic in a newspaper study of class and income
mobility in America, "Class in America: Shadowy Lines That Still
Divide" NYTimes 05/15/2005, http://tinyurl.com/764f8 explored prestige
and respect as awarded to various occupations (also education, income
and wealth). "Artists and Related Workers" were slightly above the
median along with film makers, writers, photographers and designers;
police, firefighters, farmers and managers. Computer tech people (hello
geeks), legal, medical, educational and engineering led the pack, with
food, service, caring, maintenance and manual labor holding down the
bottom.
Pride is a funny thing for an artist, as powerful a force as for a
politician, but in a different way. Few other things that people do are
so involved with vanity, so apparently worthless or futile. The
constructs necessary to sustain any self-reflexive activity can get
pretty complicated. Potters can thankfully let a peach, coffee or
flowers grace and inhabit their work, their products, and get around
the paradox of conceit.
Intrinsic value of a thing can be referenced by the materials or craft
involved. Any extrinsic value of art presupposes other benefits and is
kind of parasitic. We may need art culturally and individually,
publicly and privately, but it's a non-essential commodity. The only
way I see around this humility-dissolving superfluous insufficiency,
because the clay stuff of my sculpture doesn't hold any water, is to do
it to please myself, make it a theoretical caprice, an intentional
whim, or a haphazard venomous pride.
Unfortunately, like al from wisconsin, I don't much care what other
people think of what I do. But then again I really do. I care what the
people in the quartile of my quantile think, see and know.
But while non-judgmental thoughts and ideas are reference, embodiment
and relation, thoughts about how pots and artists appear and approval
of those who look down at what we do, or up, or shiftily sideways have
little value, serve little purpose but to remind one of appearance,
position and place and ultimately of vanity, ostracism and alienation.
And say little of anything but the speaker's own pride. Some attitudes
toward art and artists can speak curiously and sadly of deprivation.
Many responses can be refreshing. Some can be vaguely uninteresting and
some beneath one's dignity; others demand we stand on our dignity and
right. Lazy or despicable and cowardly personal attacks intending to
demean and harm cause us to re-enlist, to affiliate and defend our
percentile. To identify and self-proclaim.
Random acts of bravado and measured responses in a range from legal to
housekeeping remind us all that Artists and Related Workers have a
broad outlook from our perch smack in the middle of society.
-- R. Mutt
We are therefore I do. now and then. K. Forer
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logan johnson on sun 28 aug 05
I do not hook pipes together that allow water to move from one place to another : I am not a plumber.
I do not work at a bank window giving/taking money: I am not a bank teller.
I do not write with my left hand : I am a "rightie".
I attempt to make ceramic art because it makes my heart & mind happy: I am a potter & ceramic artist.
Logan Johnson Audeo Studios
www.audeostudios.com
"Carpe Argillam!!"
David Beumee on sun 28 aug 05
-------------- Original message ----------------------
Vince wrote:
> An artist is just someone who makes art, plain and simple, and art is just
> visual expression, plain and simple, with no qualitative judgement implied.
> There are good and great artists, but the word "artist" does not imply good
> or great.
When that one in a hundred appears at the opening of the kiln, I find myself asking in surprise, "who made that?". The position that potters are in, of being removed from the result of our work, gives us the possibility of insight to this question. What is it about a piece that might have escaped my attention and seemed entirely average going into the firing, that came out and gave me the next direction in my work, that changed and increased my vocabulary as an artist and a potter? Who is the artist and who is the maker? Those special pieces are works of art and singular pieces because they contain spirit. They are in-spired. It is when I see such pieces that I know the meaning of art.
I'm a potter, and I have alot of customers who say, "I don't know much about art, but I know it when I ses it." Isn't it true? You can feel such pieces in your heart and chest, like seeing a Modigliani portrait for the first time.
In the catalog "how Great is our Joy", new porcelains by Brother Thomas, there is a story of a woman potter from Craftsbury Vermont who made a close study of Brother Thomas' work and said to John Maki, the author of an essay in the catalog, "He (Brother Thomas) has been touched by God." This gets to the heart of why I am stunned by his work and why certain pieces pound at my heart when they appear before me. There is something unexplicable about them.
When I dared open the Unconscious in 1991 by keeping a dream journal, I had this dream: "I come upon an artist transferring hot thin sheets of wax onto a stoneware platter as a resist technique. I realize it is my platter he is decorating, and I hurry to get the wax peeled away from a platter which is already dramatically decorated and finished. He asks me why I am doing this to his plate, and I realize he is right. I back away, saying "it certainly looks like my work," and then after some hesitation I shout,"I'm Sorry!" Then the artist shakes my hand and smiles. Everything is OK." Since then I ask continually, "whose platter is it?" Who is the artist and who is the maker?"
David Beumee
Lafayette, CO
From: Vince Pitelka
> > why is so special to be an artist?
> > plumber
> > engineer
> > attorney
> > accountant
> > carpenter
> > artist
> > bricklayer
> > they are occupations. life styles.
>
> Exactly. I appreciate what Lili wrote, but that is just one interpretation
> of the word "artist" - like "She's a real artist in the garden." As I see
> it, an artist is just someone who makes art, and there is no qualitative
> judgement there. The art might be crappy, but the maker is still an artist.
>
> Making the word "artist" something high and mighty just prolonges the
> separation that exists in our society between artists and everyone else, and
> between art and the realities of everyday life. Art-making should be a
> natural part of life. As I have said ad-nauseum on this list, every child
> starts out as an artist - making art in a very intuitive, natural fashion.
> If they were encouraged to continue this as they grew older, they would gain
> skill and sensibility in the arts, and our society would be filled with
> artists. The world would be a MUCH better place.
>
> - Vince
>
> Vince Pitelka
> Appalachian Center for Craft, Tennessee Technological University
> Smithville TN 37166, 615/597-6801 x111
> vpitelka@dtccom.net, wpitelka@tntech.edu
> http://iweb.tntech.edu/wpitelka/
> http://www.tntech.edu/craftcenter/
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
Noel on sun 28 aug 05
Recently my 87 year old mother listed "painter" as her occupation on a
doctor's form. He said he was surprised that she was still working, did she
do a lot of work, did she have many customers, and did she feel this was
safe at her age? Mom assured him she did indeed still paint every day,
still has regular customers and she felt quite safe since she now did her
work sitting down.
About this time I explained that she is an "artist" and the doctor was
pleasantly relieved. I can imagine his vision of her on ladders!
My mother is an extremely accomplished "artist" so why does she call herself
a "painter"? "Because that is what I do...paint!" she says.
Noel Gilliam
Hickory Flat, Georgia
Charter Member Potters Council
Ann Brink on sun 28 aug 05
This is a fascinating dream; I am curious whether the wax sheet technique is
something you were already doing, or visualizing, or did you try it after
you had the dream?
Did the "artist" seem to be anyone familiar? Or just a generic person whom
you knew to be an artist? Of course you constructed him- a way of giving
yourself a message.
Several times I have had the experience of (just before or after sleep)
suddenly "seeing" a work of art- in one case hanging on a gallery wall. And
knew I would make it, and did. I think we all visualize things we want to
make, with variations, but these several times, totally surprising (to me)
things just popped into my field of vision.(no, not my real field of vision
(:-).
Ann Brink in Lompoc CA
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Beumee"
> When I dared open the Unconscious in 1991 by keeping a dream journal, I
had this dream: "I come upon an artist transferring hot thin sheets of wax
onto a stoneware platter as a resist technique. I realize it is my platter
he is decorating, and I hurry to get the wax peeled away from a platter
which is already dramatically decorated and finished. He asks me why I am
doing this to his plate, and I realize he is right. I back away, saying "it
certainly looks like my work," and then after some hesitation I shout,"I'm
Sorry!" Then the artist shakes my hand and smiles. Everything is OK." Since
then I ask continually, "whose platter is it?" Who is the artist and who is
the maker?"
>
> David Beumee
> Lafayette, CO
>
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