Pfeiffer, Dan R (Dan) on wed 26 oct 05
I seem to have a problem getting anything taller than about 8". I start with
2lb of clay and in a few pulls I get up to 8" and have been unable to do
anything to make anything taller. If I add more clay, same thing, fast up to
8" and than it just wants to get wider but not taller. Is there some trick
to make this work? Any good books or videos that someone can recommend?
Dan & Laurel in Elkmont Al
Potters Council Members
marianne kuiper milks on wed 26 oct 05
Hi. I've been struggling with that last spring and I
think maybe you can try these (they worked for me)
Use a bit more clay.
Slow down the wheel as your form gets higher.
Slightly thinner toward the top than you are doing now
so the weight doesn't want to lean outward.
Move your hand slowly, esp. as you slow down
speedDon't push outward with your left/in-pot hand.
Never push anything, let it flow.
Let the work stand for a bit (or use a hair-dryer) to
stiffen it up before continuing., Maybe after 6or 7"?
Try using less water as you get up higher: saturated
clay tends to fall/implode.
Will this help? Dunno - but for me it did eventually.
seemed forever..
Good luck, Marianne Kuiper Milks, Revelstone Whatever
Claystuff.
--- "Pfeiffer, Dan R (Dan)"
wrote:
> I seem to have a problem getting anything taller
> than about 8". I start with
> 2lb of clay and in a few pulls I get up to 8" and
> have been unable to do
> anything to make anything taller. If I add more
> clay, same thing, fast up to
> 8" and than it just wants to get wider but not
> taller. Is there some trick
> to make this work? Any good books or videos that
> someone can recommend?
>
>
> Dan & Laurel in Elkmont Al
> Potters Council Members
>
>
______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change
> your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be
> reached at melpots@pclink.com.
>
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Pfeiffer, Dan R (Dan) on wed 26 oct 05
I have been trying all but the hair-dryer. The clay does not fall it just
that the pull does not work above a fixed height. There must be some small
thing that must change for the form to go up. If I use a lot of clay 10# or
so I can build a form on a form and get more height but what I am trying to
make is a tall thin beer stein and am getting frustrated that I can't get it
any taller than 8". I tried making it wider than I needed and with a fast
collaring pull up and in to try and make it taller, no luck the walls just
got thicker.
Dan
>>>>>>
Hi. I've been struggling with that last spring and I
think maybe you can try these (they worked for me)
Use a bit more clay.
Slow down the wheel as your form gets higher.
Slightly thinner toward the top than you are doing now
so the weight doesn't want to lean outward.
Move your hand slowly, esp. as you slow down
speedDon't push outward with your left/in-pot hand.
Never push anything, let it flow.
Let the work stand for a bit (or use a hair-dryer) to
stiffen it up before continuing., Maybe after 6or 7"?
Try using less water as you get up higher: saturated
clay tends to fall/implode.>>>>>>
Mike Gordon on wed 26 oct 05
Hi,
At a certain point in throwing larger amounts of clay it is necessary
to change the way you move the clay. When first starting out we are
taught to keep the pressure points opposite of each other. Then bring
the hands up slowly so that the wheel makes a complete revolution
before you move your hands up. You can see this by the spacing of your
finger lines in the clay. They should be one on top of the other just
like the threads on a screw. When using more clay to throw with I
change the position of my hands. My inside hand is lower than my
outside hand so that the outside pressure point is above my fingers on
the inside. They stay this way until I get to the top of the cylinder
then they even out so that I can stabilize the lip. I have seen this
done in reverse also. The outside hand lower than the inside. You can
pick whatever way is most comfortable for you. As Mel has said in the
past, you can use a lot of water if you throw quick. I would agree, and
for a cylinder, say 12" tall, I would practice using 4-5 pulls using as
much water as you feel you need. Sponge out the puddle at the bottom
between pulls, keep it as dry as possible. Remember it is a lot easier
to pull the clay out than it is in getting it back into a cylinder. The
clay will go wherever you push or pull it. If it is going out, than you
are using too much pressure on the inside. Try to throw an upside down
cone while you are pulling the cylinder, then push it out to the stein
shape you want. Hope this helps, Mike Gordon
Elizabeth Priddy on wed 26 oct 05
I have followed this thread and I think the information
on this part of my website might help
it has some tips on getting height
http://www.elizabethpriddy.com/pottery.html
Elizabeth Priddy
Beaufort, NC - USA
http://www.elizabethpriddy.com
I, like most people, don't go around
intending to step on toes and make folks cry.
Take it with a grain of salt.
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Taylor from Rockport on wed 26 oct 05
Dan,
Weigh out about half a dozen balls of clay, whatever weight you want, but
over 2 lbs each. Center and open up your first ball. measure how wide you
make the base (ample for your inside hand) and then pull up your wall.
When you max out on height, stop, take note of how many pulls it took you,
measure how high your wall is exactly, and then cut that sucker down the
middle to reveal your wall thickness. Measure wall thickness and take note
of where you have left extra clay. You have left extra clay, no? Okay,
now throw the second ball, trying to duplicate the opening up of your first
ball:same floor thickness, same diameter, etc. When you pull, pay
particular attention to where you left that extra clay.
The fact that you mention your max height is steady at about 8" regardless
of the amount of clay you use leads me to speculate that it could be
something ergonomic you are doing to limit yourself. (The only constant
here is the dimentions of your body) Try this exercise then let us know
some more information. Good luck, and remember have no fear.
Taylor, in Rockport TX
On Wed, 26 Oct 2005 13:47:58 -0500, Pfeiffer, Dan R (Dan)
wrote:
>I have been trying all but the hair-dryer. The clay does not fall it just
>that the pull does not work above a fixed height. There must be some small
>thing that must change for the form to go up. If I use a lot of clay 10# or
>so I can build a form on a form and get more height but what I am trying to
>make is a tall thin beer stein and am getting frustrated that I can't get
it
>any taller than 8". I tried making it wider than I needed and with a fast
>collaring pull up and in to try and make it taller, no luck the walls just
>got thicker.
>
>Dan
Marek & Pauline Drzazga-Donaldson on wed 26 oct 05
Dan,=20
sometimes it is the clay that is no good not the thrower. Use a =
different clay, use it soft, and as you draw up relax your left hand in =
towards the centre.
=20
happy potting Marek www.no9uk.com www.moley.uk.com
Pat Southwood on wed 26 oct 05
Hi Dan,
The best tips I had were to throw tall cylinders standing up, with one leg
still either side of the wheel , but with your body angled so that you can
sort of brace side saddle.
Come up with your whole body rather than just your arms.
Use the middle finger of your left hand to throw up against.
Look at what is happenning with what your left hand, check angles and
lubrication.
Keep your elbow pointing up to the ceiling. Yes, it is weird.
Bring your left thumb over the top as soon as possible
Compress the base asap and keep the water out of it.
Collar and set the rim after every pull.
Good luck.
Pat Southwood.
pat@southwood4.fsnet.co.uk
. _________________________________________________
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>
>
louroess2210 on wed 26 oct 05
On Oct 26, 2005, at 10:30 AM, Pfeiffer, Dan R (Dan) wrote:
> I seem to have a problem getting anything taller than about 8". I
Dan, throwing tall is one of those subjects that recurs often on
Clayart, so check the archives for more info. I don't throw very
tall either, so have no hints for you.
Lou
dannon rhudy on wed 26 oct 05
.......The clay does not fall it just
> that the pull does not work above a fixed height. There must be some small
> thing that must change for the form to go up. .....
There are a number of things to try, and you've gotten
some advice already. You might try throwing from a
tall(er) stool. I do a lot of throwing standing up, but when
I want to throw something tall, like a lamp base or such,
I sit on a tall stool - about what you'd use for a counter/
kitchen stool. If I try to pull up from a low stool, I reach
a point (about 12-13 inches) where I'm no longer pulling,
but instead am pushing - and it does not work for me.
A tall stool lifts me up high enough to pull a tall cylindar
without effort, though. And I learned that from one
of the most effortless "throwers" I've ever seen: Val
Cushing. Give it a try, you might be surprised.
regards
Dannon Rhudy
---
---
Liz Willoughby on thu 27 oct 05
Dan,
What works for me is to pull up a couple of times, then just pull up
the top half, go back in and pull from the base all the way up. That
way you do not have so much weight at the top of the cylinder and the
clay moves easily.
Liz
>On Oct 26, 2005, at 10:30 AM, Pfeiffer, Dan R (Dan) wrote:
>
>>I seem to have a problem getting anything taller than about 8". I
--
Meticky Liz from Grafton, Ontario, Canada
"Why should we be in such desperate haste to succeed, and in such
desperate enterprises? If a man does not keep his pace with his
companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let
him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away."
Henry David Thoreau
William & Susan Schran User on thu 27 oct 05
On 10/26/05 12:30 PM, "Pfeiffer, Dan R (Dan)"
wrote:
> I seem to have a problem getting anything taller than about 8". I start with
> 2lb of clay and in a few pulls I get up to 8" and have been unable to do
> anything to make anything taller. If I add more clay, same thing, fast up to
> 8" and than it just wants to get wider but not taller. Is there some trick
> to make this work?
How wide are your making the opening? The wider the form, the less clay
available for wall height.
After the first two pulls, try collaring the cylinder to create a narrower
shape, which will also thicken the wall allowing more clay to be pulled up.
-- William "Bill" Schran
Fredericksburg, Virginia
wschran@cox.net
wschran@nvcc.edu
Dirk Deceuninck on thu 27 oct 05
Hi everybody,
It has been a long time since I posted a reaction. For the record , I live
in Belgium and I'm a potter. No , I don't live of it because being an artist
doesn't pay off, unfortunately...
I would to react on the subject of throwing tall... I throw pots up to a
height of 35 to 45 cm (don't ask for inches :-) ) So if you want some
advice, I will gladly (try to) give it. Since English isn't my native tongue
it isn't always easy to find out how to explain it.
Dirk Deceuninck
http://go.to/dirk.deceuninck (it needs updating ....)
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] Namens louroess2210
Verzonden: donderdag 27 oktober 2005 0:53
Aan: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Onderwerp: Re: throwing tall
On Oct 26, 2005, at 10:30 AM, Pfeiffer, Dan R (Dan) wrote:
> I seem to have a problem getting anything taller than about 8". I
Dan, throwing tall is one of those subjects that recurs often on
Clayart, so check the archives for more info. I don't throw very
tall either, so have no hints for you.
Lou
____________________________________________________________________________
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mea rhee on thu 27 oct 05
A technique I learned in Joyce Michaud's Masters Throwing workshop
years ago has really improved my tall throwing.... undercut your
buttress. There's a long physics-based explanation for this, but the
short explanation is the clay wants to move towards the buttress, as in
down and out. If you cut the buttress off, the easiest direction for
the clay to move is up. So every few pulls, take an angled wooden tool
and trim the bottom 3/4 inch of your cylinder into a 45 degree inward
angle, then continue pulling up as usual. I have friends who say this
makes no difference, so try it and see if it works for you.
_______________
mea rhee
good elephant pottery
www.goodelephant.com
Michael Wendt on thu 27 oct 05
Dan & Laurel ,
Much of the advice given is right on so I want to add this point:
The softer the clay is, the more difficult it is to stand a tall wall.
I am basing this on my own experience backed up by yield
measurements made with the clay softness tester I built.
As the moisture level in the clay goes up, its ability to
support a load declines so if you want taller pots, first
try drying the clay out before you wedge it, then wire
wedge it thoroughly and finally, work quickly to avoid
absorbing too much water during the early stages of
forming. I suspect that you may be victim of too soft clay
since what you describe is a yield problem where the
weight of the added clay above thickens and widens the
wall beneath, limiting how tall you can throw.
Regards,
Michael Wendt
Wendt Pottery
2729 Clearwater Ave
Lewiston, Idaho 83501
USA
wendtpot@lewiston.com
www.wendtpottery.com
I seem to have a problem getting anything taller than about 8". I start with
2lb of clay and in a few pulls I get up to 8" and have been unable to do
anything to make anything taller. If I add more clay, same thing, fast up to
8" and than it just wants to get wider but not taller. Is there some trick
to make this work? Any good books or videos that someone can recommend?
Dan & Laurel in Elkmont Al
Pfeiffer, Dan R (Dan) on thu 27 oct 05
I will give this a try tonight. Thanks to all who offered help. When I get
this to work i'll reply back with what worked. So far the most likly thing I
have heard it to pull the top half and than the bottom while doing all the
other things suggected. :)
Dan & Laurel in Elkmont Al.
>>>>>>A technique I learned in Joyce Michaud's Masters Throwing workshop
years ago has really improved my tall throwing.... undercut your
buttress. >>>>>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
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melpots@pclink.com.
JOYCE LEE on sat 29 oct 05
Malcolm mentioned using a sponge while throwing and taking
fewer pulls. I use two sponges, one in each hand, when I hope
to throw beyond 9 or 10 inches .... and usually manage .... if I
hold my head and my tongue and my toes just right.... to make
my objective.
I've been told by several instructors that the two sponge method
doesn't make a lot of sense and I ought to work on the more
conventional methods (?) ....... but several of our Clayart gurus
have said ..... after watching me throw...... if it works, do it. I
agree. And do.
Joyce
In the Mojave desert of California happy to see Mel back leading the
parade, but very pleased with claybuds who have been great.
AND wondering WHY anybody thinks that primalmommy needs
defending???!!! If she does, she can do if herself just fine..... =
you'll
hardly know what happened after she breezes through...... but you
WILL feel the breeze...... Kelly Katrina, that is she.
William & Susan Schran User on sun 30 oct 05
On 10/29/05 7:25 PM, "JOYCE LEE" wrote:
> I've been told by several instructors that the two sponge method
> doesn't make a lot of sense and I ought to work on the more
> conventional methods
When I demonstrate throwing, for beginners and advanced alike, I always
stress that there is no one "right way" to do it.
My techniques have evolved over the years based on what I've seen others do
and my own discoveries. I encourage my students to adapt & evolve. Try
different things. I also strongly encourage them to talk and demonstrate to
each other. Teaching is the best way to learn!
I think the most important thing to do is to explain the "why" of each step.
If the student understands why, then they are more likely to follow the
instruction.
Beyond as many demonstrations as they want and a written step-by-step
throwing guide, I have, just this year, done a throwing video that is burned
on several DVD's that are kept in the studio. Students are welcome to take
them home for review and they are also allowed to burn their own copies.
-- William "Bill" Schran
Fredericksburg, Virginia
wschran@cox.net
wschran@nvcc.edu
Ann Brink on mon 31 oct 05
Ivor, I would think as the weight increases, it is impossible to have the
walls as thin as they are in the one or two-pound cylinders, in other words,
load bearing walls must be sturdier than free standing ones. Is this too
simple an answer?
I could throw five one pound cylinders, each 4 inches high, stack them when
they firm up a bit.....
Ann Brink in Lompoc CA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ivor and Olive Lewis"
Dear Friends,
I have tried to be reserved with this thread. Much of what I can say about
the topic has been published in PMI or Clayart. So, not wanting to overload
the Archives I have kept quiet.
Here are some propositions.
Think of a cylinder with an interior diameter a palm width wide. All the
cylinders to follow are a palm width wide. That is constant !
From one pound you will easily get a cylinder a palm with high, which is
about four inches. Remember this includes the base so that will never have
to be made again.
From two pounds of clay you will readily achieve a cylinder two palm widths
high, or about eight inches.
Most people will struggle to make a cylinder three palm widths high from
three pounds of clay. But after a few tries they may become proficient.
Faced with four pound of clay, it is a struggle to get the clay to stand
four hand widths high which is about sixteen inches. At this point some of
the ladies and other folk standing less than five foot three have a distinct
advantage.
In the same way that anyone can drink a pint of beer in a minute but find it
impossible to drink five pints within five minutes, throwing five pounds of
clay to one foot eight inches with an interior diameter of one palm width is
nigh on impossible.
By all means disagree with me.
But I as the questions.
Why or why not?
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis.
Redhill,
South Australia.
Scott Paulding on mon 31 oct 05
hi ivor,
my guess is that it is near impossible, and that the answer is gravity. in
order for a cylinder to support itself, the base has to be strong enough
to support the clay right above it, and that clay needs to support the
clay above it and so on until the top. since the base has to support all
of the weight above it, it has to have enough strength in it. to me, that
means a compressed, and thick wall.
in order to get 5 pounds of clay that tall, the walls would have to be too
thin to support the weight, and it would collapse.
-scott
--- Ivor and Olive Lewis wrote:
> Dear Friends,
> I have tried to be reserved with this thread. Much of what I can say
> about the topic has been published in PMI or Clayart. So, not wanting to
> overload the Archives I have kept quiet.
> Here are some propositions.
> Think of a cylinder with an interior diameter a palm width wide. All the
> cylinders to follow are a palm width wide. That is constant !
> From one pound you will easily get a cylinder a palm with high, which is
> about four inches. Remember this includes the base so that will never
> have to be made again.
> From two pounds of clay you will readily achieve a cylinder two palm
> widths high, or about eight inches.
> Most people will struggle to make a cylinder three palm widths high from
> three pounds of clay. But after a few tries they may become proficient.
> Faced with four pound of clay, it is a struggle to get the clay to stand
> four hand widths high which is about sixteen inches. At this point some
> of the ladies and other folk standing less than five foot three have a
> distinct advantage.
> In the same way that anyone can drink a pint of beer in a minute but
> find it impossible to drink five pints within five minutes, throwing
> five pounds of clay to one foot eight inches with an interior diameter
> of one palm width is nigh on impossible.
> By all means disagree with me.
> But I as the questions.
> Why or why not?
> Best regards,
> Ivor Lewis.
> Redhill,
> South Australia.
>
>
______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
"Do you realize...that happiness makes you cry?"
-The Flaming Lips
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Ivor and Olive Lewis on mon 31 oct 05
Dear Friends,
I have tried to be reserved with this thread. Much of what I can say =
about the topic has been published in PMI or Clayart. So, not wanting to =
overload the Archives I have kept quiet.
Here are some propositions.
Think of a cylinder with an interior diameter a palm width wide. All the =
cylinders to follow are a palm width wide. That is constant !
From one pound you will easily get a cylinder a palm with high, which is =
about four inches. Remember this includes the base so that will never =
have to be made again.
From two pounds of clay you will readily achieve a cylinder two palm =
widths high, or about eight inches.
Most people will struggle to make a cylinder three palm widths high from =
three pounds of clay. But after a few tries they may become proficient.
Faced with four pound of clay, it is a struggle to get the clay to stand =
four hand widths high which is about sixteen inches. At this point some =
of the ladies and other folk standing less than five foot three have a =
distinct advantage.
In the same way that anyone can drink a pint of beer in a minute but =
find it impossible to drink five pints within five minutes, throwing =
five pounds of clay to one foot eight inches with an interior diameter =
of one palm width is nigh on impossible.
By all means disagree with me.
But I as the questions.
Why or why not?
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis.
Redhill,
South Australia.
Michael Wendt on tue 1 nov 05
Ivor,
It is not just the weight of the walls that poses the problem with this
scenario. I find that torsional forces play a big role in this kind of
throwing. When I throw my very slick porcelain, at first I have no feel for
it but after a while, I can throw taller and thinner than my stoneware. The
reason? Finger tip drag is less and so does not torque
the pot. Moment = Force x Distance. Drag is the force.
When throwing tall cylinders, I watch the lower 1/3 of the
wall for signs of buckling to know when I have reached
the limit of the clay.
Regards,
Michael Wendt
Wendt Pottery
2729 Clearwater Ave
Lewiston, Idaho 83501
USA
wendtpot@lewiston.com
www.wendtpottery.com
Ivor and Olive Lewis on wed 2 nov 05
Dear Scott Paulding,
You pretty much describe what is happening. Gravity Rules and plastic =
clay must obey
Thanks for making a contribution to the thread.
Best regards,
Ivor
Ivor and Olive Lewis on wed 2 nov 05
Dear Michael Wendt,
This is good advice for anyone who is trying to master the art of =
elevating clay,
it but after a while, I can throw taller and thinner than my stoneware. =
The
reason? Finger tip drag is less and so does not torque>
Two points:
a) Are you using pure fresh water or slip as a lubricant ?
b) Even if you do not get the twisting effect because you control the =
Torque, do you recognise a point in the process when the clay seems to =
slide back down and thicken up even though you seem to be making height =
?
thanks for your contribution to the thread.
Best regards,
Ivor.
Ivor and Olive Lewis on wed 2 nov 05
Dear Ann Brink,=20
As good and as simple a way of putting it as anyone could devise.
What is below must have the compressive strength to support what is =
above. Which is why many teachers use thrown sections, as you suggest, =
to get tall pots. So thicker walls support thinner walls.
Thanks for making a contribution.
Best regards,
Ivor
Steve Irvine on wed 2 nov 05
In many cases it makes a lot of sense to simply let the form stiffen up a bit and then add a coil of
clay to continue throwing, rather than trying to wrestle a big ball of clay into a really big form.
Susan Peterson's book on Hamada has some great photos of the technique being used, even on
some very modest sized pots.
Back in the Jurassic Period I wrote an article for Ceramics Monthly (March '74 issue actually, it sold
for 60 cents a copy then!) on extended throwing. A fairly straight forward method of making
pieces as tall as yourself, if you liked. The pots I was making then were in the 300 to 400 pound
range, and we would use a fork lift to load them into the kiln.
There may be a few old copies of the magazine around, or CM has old issues available on CD. The
article also features photos of me sporting a very stylish head band!
Steve
http://www.steveirvine.com
Malcolm Schosha on wed 2 nov 05
Ivor and Olive Lewis wrote:
>What is below must have the compressive strength to support what is above. Which is why many teachers use thrown sections, as you suggest, to get tall pots. So thicker walls support thinner walls.
........................................
Ivor,
It is quite possible to throw a tall pot with an even distribution of clay throughout, or even with the lower part of the pot a little thinner than the upper section.
Some potters do like to throw large pots in several pieces; but an 18" tall by 12" wide cylinder (fired size) is quite possible, and it can be done in two pulls of the clay. When I was throwing umbrella stands every day in Italy, I could throw a cylinder that size with about a 1/8" section.
Throwing in parts is good for very big pieces. I guy I worked with in Italy used to throw 7' tall storage jars in three sections.
Malcolm Schosha
---------------------------------
Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.
Bill Paxton on wed 2 nov 05
Where can I get a copy of the "Throwing Tall Pots" by Ivor Lewis from the
fall 1998 Pottery Making Illustrated magazine?
Either a purchase or photocopy is fine as the magazine does not have any
left.
Scott Paulding on thu 3 nov 05
you're welcome ivor.
one last thing to add, a slightly parabolic (hyperbolic?) curve in the
cylinder is stronger, even when thinner than a straight or conical
cylinder is. i don't know the physics behind it, other than that when
distributing weight, an arch works better than a straight line, just look
at a bridge sometime, and you'll probably see a big arch for weight
distribution, and not angular lines.
so, taking all of these factors into account, it's probably possible to
throw a 20" cylinder w/ 5#s of clay. just don't ask me to do it :)
-scott (oh yeah, located in rainy seattle, wa)
--- Ivor and Olive Lewis wrote:
> Dear Scott Paulding,
>
> You pretty much describe what is happening. Gravity Rules and plastic
> clay must obey
>
> Thanks for making a contribution to the thread.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Ivor
>
>
>
"Do you realize...that happiness makes you cry?"
-The Flaming Lips
__________________________________
Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.
http://farechase.yahoo.com
Rog Coman on thu 3 nov 05
Hi Bill,
Send me your personal e-mail and I think I can help you out.
Rog Coman
Fish Hook Pottery
Montrose, CO
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Paxton"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2005 1:44 PM
Subject: Throwing Tall
> Where can I get a copy of the "Throwing Tall Pots" by Ivor Lewis from the
> fall 1998 Pottery Making Illustrated magazine?
>
> Either a purchase or photocopy is fine as the magazine does not have any
> left.
>
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