Mary/Adams on fri 6 jan 06
Hi guys,
I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best methods you
might like to share? Is it better to do molds? And, if so, how?
m
louroess2210 on fri 6 jan 06
On Jan 6, 2006, at 8:18 AM, Mary/Adams wrote:
>
> I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
> platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best
> methods you
> might like to share? Is it better to do molds? And, if so, how?
>
> m
Dear m,
Do you first lift the rim as if you were making a very wide
cylinder , then lay it down when the clay has stiffened some? Might
be worth a try.
Molds are easy. Buy a commercial piece that's bigger than you want
your piece to be to allow for shrinkage. Roll out a slab and apply it
to the piece, using a separator like talc, plastic or tissue paper.
Place a thin piece of cloth on top and rib it smooth. Trim the
edges . You can let it dry in the mold since it is a slump mold.
Good luck
Lou in Colorado
David Gallagher on fri 6 jan 06
Mary,
I was making tank weight plates for a while myself. Here is what I've been doing to lighten them up. Throw a large wide disk of clay about an inch larger than you want the base to be, this will vary depending on what you want the base to be, for me the key is having enough clay to support the walls.And have enough height left in the clay to open up a big wide whole to the edge of your disk. This part was hard for me to get, takes some practice. You have to compress the top lip while your pulling out, and I have to go pretty slow to keep every thing uniform. to cut the weight make sure your not leaving more clay at the bottom than what you normally would. It was hard for me to eyeball, so I have to use a needle tool to check.
Once you have your big old doggie dish shape. Do a pull straight up to get the walls to proper thickness.Then start at the base/wall transition on the inside of the plate and the very bottom of the outside, and do slow gental slightly horisontal pulls untill you get the level of the rim to where you want it. Don't be afraid stop and walk away for a couple minutes inbetween pulls on the wall to let it set up a bit, I have to do this cause I throw REALLY wet and the clay gets mushy. If im in a hurry I just use a blow torch but thats a different story.
What I dont do with plates is try to cut into the base and trim off the extra clay while its still wet. For me there is too little space and the form to unstable to put this kind of stress on it when its wet.
For cracking, Im not sure when this is happening so I'll just ramble. If its happening when they are drying before trimming... I put a peice of news paper over the rim to slow down the drying. works pretty well.
If its happening during trimming, I would bet that it is too dry and that your rim is too thin. Putting some kind of padding underneath the plate helps support it. There is a lot of pressure put such a wide/low form when you trim.
If they are cracking while drying after trimming, try turning them upside down and covering them up to slow the drying.
Hope this is some kind of help.
David
Mary/Adams wrote:
Hi guys,
I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best methods you
might like to share? Is it better to do molds? And, if so, how?
m
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Joe and Lisa Troncale on fri 6 jan 06
The potter who taught me how to throw plates had three important axioms:
1.make the base wide enough and 2.compress the clay once it is opened and 3.
make sure there is sufficient thickness to the body. (you can always trim.)
Hope this helps.
Joe Troncale
----- Original Message -----
From: "louroess2210"
To:
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: Best way to make plates and platters
> On Jan 6, 2006, at 8:18 AM, Mary/Adams wrote:
>>
>> I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
>> platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best
>> methods you
>> might like to share? Is it better to do molds? And, if so, how?
>>
>> m
>
> Dear m,
> Do you first lift the rim as if you were making a very wide
> cylinder , then lay it down when the clay has stiffened some? Might
> be worth a try.
> Molds are easy. Buy a commercial piece that's bigger than you want
> your piece to be to allow for shrinkage. Roll out a slab and apply it
> to the piece, using a separator like talc, plastic or tissue paper.
> Place a thin piece of cloth on top and rib it smooth. Trim the
> edges . You can let it dry in the mold since it is a slump mold.
> Good luck
> Lou in Colorado
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
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>
Hank Murrow on fri 6 jan 06
On Jan 6, 2006, at 7:18 AM, Mary/Adams wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
> platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best methods
> you
> might like to share?
Dear Mary;
I was frustrated when making plates and other flattish forms for a
while, and developed a few processes to deal with them because I love
those big pictorial surfaces. The problem seemed to be that if you let
them dry until the bottom will support trimming, you wind up trying to
trim overhard clay with resultant 'ugly' marks. Or, you trim at a good
softness and risk pushing the bottom in.
I throw directly on bats without cutting through with a wire. I wait
perhaps 2_4 hours to alter the rims and then cut through between the
bat and the piece with a fine stainless steel twisted wire. I then
rotate the pots so they are drying evenly and wait until they are ready
to trim. I trim them on a very stiff foam rubber bat that I center on
the wheel. The plate/platter sits with its bottom supported on the foam
while I use a ball bearing roller to move the slight 'extra' clay up
into a mini-wall, which is then turned over to form a footring. I can
later set an Avery label in the center of the bisque to provide a
glaze-resisted spot for a wad of clay, which keeps the bottom from
kissing the shelf during the fire. The wire pattern can be revealed
under the glaze to good effect, the whole system 'works a treat', and
you can see it here:
http://www.murrow.biz/hank/tutorials.htm
I hope this explanation along with the tutorial on my site will make
things clear. BTW, Michael Wendt has another approach you might visit
his site to view.
Cheers, Hank
www.murrow.biz/hank
Susan Fox Hirschmann on fri 6 jan 06
In a message dated 1/6/2006 11:33:56 AM Eastern Standard Time,
louroess2210@COMCAST.NET writes:
> I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
> platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best
> methods you
> might like to share?
Compress, compress...or pack that bottom. If you were looking at the plate
as a clock you would compress with a sponge and then perhaps a flat rib from 0
to 3 oclock several times.(if you are a lefty you would do this from 0 to 9
o'clock.)
Stop once in a while to check the bottom thickness with a needle tool. 1/4"
without footrim....thicker with footrim.
The other problem, as far as cracking,could be uneven drying.....slow, slow
drying. Some people dry their plates upside down. I throw plates up to 24"
(as big as my kiln will fire!)---and change the paper under them frequently and
keep them covered for a week or so under plastic. (that is for plates over
about 12") then uncover a few hours a day, to slow the drying. Be sure they
are not getting uneven drying from studio drafts (never put them under heating
vents, or open windows) to properly control the drying.
Best of luck!
Susan
Annandale, VA
Mike Gordon on fri 6 jan 06
Mary,
Where are the cracks appearing? Are you drying them upside down? What
kind of clay are you using?? More info , please, Mike Gordon
On Jan 6, 2006, at 7:18 AM, Mary/Adams wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
> platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best methods
> you
> might like to share? Is it better to do molds? And, if so, how?
>
> m
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> _______
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
steve graber on fri 6 jan 06
when i was slowly graduating from small to bigger pieces the part that held me back was that i wasn't letting myself develop a larger base to go with the larger pieces. while i'd start with more poundage, i'd keep more or less the same-similar base & same-similar cylinder diameters. once i got into simply bigger bases bigger pieces happened more normally.
see ya
steve
Mary/Adams wrote: Hi guys,
I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best methods you
might like to share? Is it better to do molds? And, if so, how?
m
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
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Jennifer Boyer on fri 6 jan 06
Basically to make a plate I throw a flat clay pancake on the bat and
then raise a lip at the very end. The pancake starts getting a slight
dip in the middle towards the end of throwing to make sure there is a
thicker outer area to make the rim with. So a lot depends on the tools
I use. You might try different kinds of wood throwing ribs to use to
flatten out the pancake. Try one with a curved shape.
Every thrown shape presents a learning curve at first....hang in there.
Jennifer
On Jan 6, 2006, at 11:24 AM, louroess2210 wrote:
> On Jan 6, 2006, at 8:18 AM, Mary/Adams wrote:
>>
>> I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
>> platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best
>> methods you
>> might like to share? Is it better to do molds? And, if so, how?
>>
>> m
>
> Dear m,
> Do you first lift the rim as if you were making a very wide
> cylinder , then lay it down when the clay has stiffened some? Might
> be worth a try.
> Molds are easy. Buy a commercial piece that's bigger than you want
> your piece to be to allow for shrinkage. Roll out a slab and apply it
> to the piece, using a separator like talc, plastic or tissue paper.
> Place a thin piece of cloth on top and rib it smooth. Trim the
> edges . You can let it dry in the mold since it is a slump mold.
> Good luck
> Lou in Colorado
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> _______
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
************************
Jennifer Boyer
Thistle Hill Pottery
Montpelier, VT
http://thistlehillpottery.com
Donald G. Goldsobel on fri 6 jan 06
Successful plates come from sucessful drying and being patient. Plate rims
dry faster than their bottoms and this can cause stress and subsequent
cracking. I cover the plates with plastic while the plates are still too
soft to remove from the bat. I make a hole in the plastic over the center of
the plate to let it lose some moisture. After trimming, I place them on
drywall (botttom side down)and again cover leaving the center open and the
rest covered.By the time you are just past leather hard. much of the
moisture is gone, the excess has been trimmed away and even drying is
possible with out much covering. Some potters like to paint the rims with
wax to retard the drying which also has the benefit of preventing the rims
from turning up during drying.
Happy plattering
Donald
Elizabeth Priddy on fri 6 jan 06
What Steve is saying is really important. Working a gallery
for 5 years and seeing a lot of pots with a yearly show, I was
frequently disappointed in real life to find a sizable form with
a much too thin base or foot. The scale of large forms should
extend to the thickness of the wall and the base and the foot.
It makes the difference when you pick up the piece, in how
the balance feels.
steve graber wrote:
when i was slowly graduating from small to bigger pieces the part that held me back was that i wasn't letting myself develop a larger base to go with the larger pieces. while i'd start with more poundage, i'd keep more or less the same-similar base & same-similar cylinder diameters. once i got into simply bigger bases bigger pieces happened more normally.
see ya
steve
Mary/Adams wrote: Hi guys,
I'm still struggling to make plates that are larger than 10" wide and
platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best methods you
might like to share? Is it better to do molds? And, if so, how?
m
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
---------------------------------
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______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
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Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
Elizabeth Priddy
Beaufort, NC - USA
http://www.elizabethpriddy.com
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Bonnie Staffel on sat 7 jan 06
Hi Mary and other Clayarters,
Sorry you are having so much trouble making large platters. I have been
making very large and up to 24" platters easily and rarely with a crack
using my Coil and Slab method as shown on my video. As most know I am a
"senior" citizen potter with many years experience and still throwing
easily. My method even got me through recovery of a CTS operation..
Warm regards,
Bonnie Staffel
http://webpages.charter.net/bstaffel/
DVD Throwing with Coils and Slabs
DVD Beginning Processes
Charter Member Potters Council
Eleanora Eden on sat 7 jan 06
Hi all,
When I was in college the TA taught us to make plates like this:
Using hands to beat the clay while slowly revolving the wheel into a
disc w/ diameter a bit bigger than the foot will be. So when you
start throwing you already have your general shape. Working your
palm down toward the center gives you the clay to grab to bring up
your rim. One pull and your rim is up. Then one big swoop with a
very large rib and you're done. Clay never got a chance to get
tired or fight back.
I have a 10" rib that I made for the purpose in somebody's wood shop
way back when out of a scrap of black walnut it is still good as new.
Then for trimming he would set the plates on a lump of clay so their
rim never touched anything during the trimming process. I don't do
that, I use a bat with a piece of that blue hiker's sleeping mat foam
that is nice and dense attached and it holds the rim gently for
trimming.
Hope this helps somebody.
Eleanora
Ivor and Olive Lewis on sun 8 jan 06
Dear Mary,
You ask...wide and platters. They remain very heavy and crack easily. Any best =
methods you might like to share? Is it better to do molds? And, if so, =
how?>....
Although you do not describe the nature of the cracks I would suggest =
that perhaps before changing your method you might try using softer =
clay. It is possible that in stretching a firm plastic clay you are =
creating fissures that become cracks when the plates start to dry.
Best regards,
Ivor Lewis.
Redhill,
South Australia.
=20
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