Craig Clark on thu 19 jan 06
I generally refer to myself as a full time potter but I am
definitely in the low end of the range, acutally less, that has been
described. It is my spousal unit who acts as the "sponser of sorts" with
the job that provides the medical insurance. If we were to try and by
insurance privately it would cost us upwards of $800/month with a family
of four for decent coverage around here.
I also do "other" things. Hire out as electrician, carpenter,
massage person and recently some consulting work. Just whatever it
takes to keep things going. Working at developing the "fifty mile
radius" plan of Mel San. .
I've only known a couple potters who were what I would describe as
truly independent and self supporting from their pottery. Met them at
festivals. They did the road show. About fifteen festivals annually.
Focused primarily on the really high end, ultra competitive somebodies
gotta die off before new blood gets in shows like Cherry Creek. They
made some pretty good dough but don't think it was in the $100K range.
COme to think of it all but one of them were married to other working
professionals who most likely carried the insurance premium as well...LOL.
Hope this helps
Craig Dunn Clark
619 East 11 1/2 St.
Houston, Texas 77008
(713)861-2083
mudman@hal-pc.org
steve graber wrote:
>from full time potters i've seen, it looks like a lifestyle choice where one partner does full time pottery, the other is a "sponsor" of sorts having a regular day job for baseline income & medical coverage.
>
> two potters i know are retired from teaching & use their pensions to maintain the household while they ~now~ do pottery full time.
>
> ~ or via full time teaching where again there is a sponsor of sorts for regular income.
>
> good question - is anyone maintaining a true living from pottery?
>
> see ya
>
> steve
>
>
>
>Tae Kim wrote:
> Hi everyone
>
>I had a question to everyone who makes a living (20k - 100K) doing pottery.
>
>I have always been curious as to how big the market actually is for all of
>us potters. I have been doing ceramics for a while now, but I never sold
>anything, but am thinking about going in a direction where I would like to
>make it my "career". However, I always doubted that the market that
>purchases the pottery would be big enough for another career potter. Is this
>true? In a life time, people make thousands and thousands of item, and how
>can there possibly be enough people to purchase all of them, especially with
>so may potters around everywhere, as this forum shows.
>
>I am just trying to make a sense outta this profession at this post
>industrial time. Only very few would use pottery as their main dishware and
>if people did purchase a pottery, it would be just a novelty item for them,
>no?
>
>I know one guy who actually makes good money selling his stuff in my area,
>but thats just one person.
>
>What do you guys all think?
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
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>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
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>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
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>
>
>
Tae Kim on thu 19 jan 06
Hi everyone
I had a question to everyone who makes a living (20k - 100K) doing pottery.
I have always been curious as to how big the market actually is for all of
us potters. I have been doing ceramics for a while now, but I never sold
anything, but am thinking about going in a direction where I would like to
make it my "career". However, I always doubted that the market that
purchases the pottery would be big enough for another career potter. Is thi=
s
true? In a life time, people make thousands and thousands of item, and how
can there possibly be enough people to purchase all of them, especially wit=
h
so may potters around everywhere, as this forum shows.
I am just trying to make a sense outta this profession at this post
industrial time. Only very few would use pottery as their main dishware and
if people did purchase a pottery, it would be just a novelty item for them,
no?
I know one guy who actually makes good money selling his stuff in my area,
but thats just one person.
What do you guys all think?
Hank Murrow on thu 19 jan 06
On Jan 19, 2006, at 12:29 PM, Tae Kim wrote:
>
> I had a question to everyone who makes a living (20k - 100K) doing
> pottery.
>
> I have always been curious as to how big the market actually is for
> all of
> us potters. I have been doing ceramics for a while now, but I never
> sold
> anything, but am thinking about going in a direction where I would
> like to
> make it my "career". However, I always doubted that the market that
> purchases the pottery would be big enough for another career potter.
> Is this
> true? In a life time, people make thousands and thousands of item, and
> how
> can there possibly be enough people to purchase all of them,
> especially with
> so may potters around everywhere, as this forum shows. Only very few
> would use pottery as their main dishware.
Dear Tae Kim;
I can make no claims for $$$ success, but I have observed that it takes
about 1000 families in one's 'neighborhood' to make a decent living.
That is, a 50 mile radius. Do you have 1000 adventurous and/or
sophisticated families within 50 mile radius? If a potter makes nice
stuff and holds studio sales twice a year, she/he could develop those
1000 families into a sustaining market. The Great Difficulty is
supporting oneself until the market comes to you.
Cheers, Hank
www.murrow.biz/hank
steve graber on thu 19 jan 06
from full time potters i've seen, it looks like a lifestyle choice where one partner does full time pottery, the other is a "sponsor" of sorts having a regular day job for baseline income & medical coverage.
two potters i know are retired from teaching & use their pensions to maintain the household while they ~now~ do pottery full time.
~ or via full time teaching where again there is a sponsor of sorts for regular income.
good question - is anyone maintaining a true living from pottery?
see ya
steve
Tae Kim wrote:
Hi everyone
I had a question to everyone who makes a living (20k - 100K) doing pottery.
I have always been curious as to how big the market actually is for all of
us potters. I have been doing ceramics for a while now, but I never sold
anything, but am thinking about going in a direction where I would like to
make it my "career". However, I always doubted that the market that
purchases the pottery would be big enough for another career potter. Is this
true? In a life time, people make thousands and thousands of item, and how
can there possibly be enough people to purchase all of them, especially with
so may potters around everywhere, as this forum shows.
I am just trying to make a sense outta this profession at this post
industrial time. Only very few would use pottery as their main dishware and
if people did purchase a pottery, it would be just a novelty item for them,
no?
I know one guy who actually makes good money selling his stuff in my area,
but thats just one person.
What do you guys all think?
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
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BJ Clark | Stinking Desert Ceramics on thu 19 jan 06
Tae,
While I'm not making a living making pottery, I'll pass on my $.02 anyway.
I'm sure that Realtor's lists get the same questions, as well as wood
workers and mechanics and everything else.
My mother has been in the commercial printing industry for over 30 years,
and that business is just like any other business, as is pottery.
You have to 1. Persevere 2. Work Harder than everyone else, and 3. Get
Lucky.
Who makes a living selling real estate? The guy that gets the three things =
I
just said.
Who makes a living in any business where *you* are the entire company? The
guy that does those three things.
You can't expect to make a living making pottery if you don't work the
hardest, or if you give up easy, or if you catch all the bad karma.
I know a guy that has been a potter for 27 years that starting going to a
particular outdoor show 11 years ago and the first time he made $400. This
year he made $12000. It takes him 3 weeks of 10 hour days with 1 or 2 days
off to throw/fire/etc. everything for that show. He's not waking up at noon
and working for a couple hours, he's doing 10 hours with a hour lunch and a=
n
assistant to pug/wedge/do the crap work. And, the get lucky part is that he
says there was a guy that used to clean up at that particular show and he
never made any money, then about 6-8 years ago, the guy retired and all of =
a
sudden he makes $5k.
If anyone else has a different experience, I'd love to hear it.
If I'm way off target, let me know, I'm with Tae really in that I have no
idea if it's even possible to make a living. There's 20 potters in the loca=
l
guild in a town of 100k people. That means there's got to be 20k hip people
for me to make a living.
BJ Clark
Stinking Desert Ceramics
Colorado
On 1/19/06, steve graber wrote:
>
> from full time potters i've seen, it looks like a lifestyle choice where
> one partner does full time pottery, the other is a "sponsor" of sorts hav=
ing
> a regular day job for baseline income & medical coverage.
>
> two potters i know are retired from teaching & use their pensions to
> maintain the household while they ~now~ do pottery full time.
>
> ~ or via full time teaching where again there is a sponsor of sorts for
> regular income.
>
> good question - is anyone maintaining a true living from pottery?
>
> see ya
>
> steve
>
>
>
> Tae Kim wrote:
> Hi everyone
>
> I had a question to everyone who makes a living (20k - 100K) doing
> pottery.
>
> I have always been curious as to how big the market actually is for all o=
f
> us potters. I have been doing ceramics for a while now, but I never sold
> anything, but am thinking about going in a direction where I would like t=
o
> make it my "career". However, I always doubted that the market that
> purchases the pottery would be big enough for another career potter. Is
> this
> true? In a life time, people make thousands and thousands of item, and ho=
w
> can there possibly be enough people to purchase all of them, especially
> with
> so may potters around everywhere, as this forum shows.
>
> I am just trying to make a sense outta this profession at this post
> industrial time. Only very few would use pottery as their main dishware
> and
> if people did purchase a pottery, it would be just a novelty item for
> them,
> no?
>
> I know one guy who actually makes good money selling his stuff in my area=
,
> but thats just one person.
>
> What do you guys all think?
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________________=
_____
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
> What are the most popular cars? Find out at Yahoo! Autos
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________________=
_____
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
--
BJ Clark
Stinking Desert Ceramics
bjclark@stinkingdesert.com
www.stinkingdesert.com
David Beumee on fri 20 jan 06
Tae Kim wrote,
"I have always been curious as to how big the market actually is for all of
us potters. I have been doing ceramics for a while now, but I never sold
anything, but am thinking about going in a direction where I would like to
make it my "career". However, I always doubted that the market that
purchases the pottery would be big enough for another career potter. Is this
true?"
There's a long haul beween finding bread and deloping those thousand buyers. Lee is right about the Twin Cites; a more stable, that is, much less transient than the Colorado high-tech Front Range. It makes it so much harder when a third of your mailing list disappears every two years.
David Beumee
Lafayette, CO
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: Tae Kim
> Hi everyone
>
> I had a question to everyone who makes a living (20k - 100K) doing pottery.
>
> I have always been curious as to how big the market actually is for all of
> us potters. I have been doing ceramics for a while now, but I never sold
> anything, but am thinking about going in a direction where I would like to
> make it my "career". However, I always doubted that the market that
> purchases the pottery would be big enough for another career potter. Is this
> true? In a life time, people make thousands and thousands of item, and how
> can there possibly be enough people to purchase all of them, especially with
> so may potters around everywhere, as this forum shows.
>
> I am just trying to make a sense outta this profession at this post
> industrial time. Only very few would use pottery as their main dishware and
> if people did purchase a pottery, it would be just a novelty item for them,
> no?
>
> I know one guy who actually makes good money selling his stuff in my area,
> but thats just one person.
>
> What do you guys all think?
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
Jacqui Kruzewski on fri 20 jan 06
Having just returned to paid employment after bringing up my kids then being
a potter for 7 years I know it's not easy. My husband has a good salary so
he was the one bringing the money in. But I live in a "poor" part of Wales,
UK. When I say poor I mean this area gets objective 1 funding from the
European Union -so poor by European standards. I know I am not good enough
or dedicated and hard working enough to support myself with ceramics -
however this is not about me.
I do know people in this area who support themselves solely with ceramics.
Bev and Terry Bell-Hughes - they suppliment by teaching ceramics. Terry has
just retired from part time college teaching - it always got in the way of
making anyway, I think, so his pension takes up the slack. I would say it's
not a big pension by any means. They also teach classes in their home - Bev
mostly. Bev is also the "Ghost Walker" in Conwy in the summer - she takes
the tourists round the haunted places of Conwy and frightens the life out of
them! I'd say they live a modest lifestyle but seem very happy surrounded by
the pots they've collected over the years and doing what they clearly love.
David and Margaret Frith are high profile North Wales potters and have
worked incredibly hard to get there. Margaret tends to look after the
business side of things as well as make porcelain pots. David is a
workaholic. He also makes all their clay - this not only cuts down on costs
but also gives them exactly the claybodies they want to work with, exactly
the quality they want. They are very good at publicity and have a fantastic
showroom in a lovely setting - all of which helps sell the pots. I would say
they sell at the higher end of the market. Whether they teach too I don't
know.
There is also Vicky Buxton. Vicky's whole income comes from her pottery just
outside Conwy. Apart from the North Wales potters Co-operative Gallery in
Conwy - for which Vicky is unpaid shop manager, and maybe one or two
galleries that buy her work, all her income comes from her
home/workshop/showroom. I think she is the main breadwinner for herself and
her partner, who works in enamels - little enamelled boxes. Their one
"advantage" is that her partner, Phil, bought two tiny derelict cottages
many years ago when they were dirt cheap and rebuilt them himself. This is
his talent. The cottages, though very practical, have been rebuilt with a
fairytale charm that is difficult to describe but works very well. When
people go to Vicky's pottery on the side of the hill, enveloped by trees
they come to a magical place. Because they own the house outright (no
repayments), have no children, and no big overheads they get by - although
it's a bit of a tightrope. I'm sure the surroundings, the architecture of
the house - as well as Vicky's charm, keep bringing people back and back to
buy her pots which match their surroundings.
It seems to me - but i may be wrong, that ist's harder to make a living from
pots in the UK - certainly in North wales. But some people do. It takes the
hard work and dedication that everyone has mentioned, and also the luck
someone talked about. I also believe that you mustn't expect a lavish
lifestyle - the best most can hope for is to get by. I don't see even the
"famous" potters here living a lavish lifestyle - Jeff Oesterich's assesment
was just about right. I think that what drives these people is not the
search for a good living from pottery (although I'm sure that would be good
too) but the obsession with making the best pots they can.
Jacqui
North Wales
>
> good question - is anyone maintaining a true living from pottery?
>
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William & Susan Schran User on fri 20 jan 06
On 1/19/06 9:57 PM, "BJ Clark | Stinking Desert Ceramics"
wrote:
> My mother has been in the commercial printing industry for over 30 years,
> and that business is just like any other business, as is pottery.
> You have to 1. Persevere 2. Work Harder than everyone else, and 3. Get
> Lucky.
I totally agree with your first two statements: persevere & work harder,
But the third is like waiting to win the lottery - you'd sooner be hit by
lightning!
The third is marketing, which goes hat & hand with #1 & #2.
If nobody knows you're there, well then, nobody knows you're there!
-- William "Bill" Schran
Fredericksburg, Virginia
wschran@cox.net
wschran@nvcc.edu
Michael Wendt on fri 20 jan 06
It is possible to earn a living in pottery without a second income from a
spouse. Both my wife and I work in the studio together. She does her line, I
do mine.
During the startup years (1973-76), I went from teaching to pottery. The
first year I made pottery full time, 1976, I made twice as much net as I had
teaching.
How?
Make what people want.
I watched at shows. I listened to customer comments and took them to heart.
Other potters would not do custom orders so I made it my business to do so.
Clear marking of the studio information on the bottom of the pots was the
final key.
Once that happened, my 50 mile radius expanded outward as far as the pots
went. Only a tiny percentage of people will like your work; ;-(
If you have your work in the homes of people all across the country and
friends like the work and turn it over, they will see how to contact you.
Your work is out there selling for you every day.
In 1991, as I began to think about retirement issues, I got a front end
loader and a fork lift and set up a clay processing plant designed to be
"turn-key" so that anyone who wanted to earn a living in clay could walk in,
take over and run it.
The real key in pottery is to be open to ideas, to be willing to try new
things, seize every opportunity and of course, to work at it like a job.
We set a goal for each day we work. A list helps. An average day's
production sees $400-800 worth of work
To live comfortably and well is the goal, right?
Gotta get back to work.
Don't give up on the goal.
Regards,
Michael Wendt
Wendt Pottery
2729 Clearwater Ave
Lewiston, Idaho 83501
USA
wendtpot@lewiston.com
www.wendtpottery.com
Steve wrote:
On 1/19/06, steve graber wrote:
>
> from full time potters i've seen, it looks like a lifestyle choice where
> one partner does full time pottery, the other is a "sponsor" of sorts
having
> a regular day job for baseline income & medical coverage.
>
> two potters i know are retired from teaching & use their pensions to
> maintain the household while they ~now~ do pottery full time.
>
> ~ or via full time teaching where again there is a sponsor of sorts for
> regular income.
>
> good question - is anyone maintaining a true living from pottery?
>
> see ya
>
> steve
Judy Rohrbaugh on fri 20 jan 06
I think like Craig. I have always thought of myself as a fulltime potter, but I am the second income, my husband is the main breadwinner with the benefits. If I wasn't doing this, and had another job, I'm sure it wouldn't pay much, knowing my personality, and what type of work I would select.
There are a lot of "second income" jobs. Many families have one main income, then the second one, The second one is neccessary even if it is lower than the primary one.
There are some potters that I meet at the art shows that do this with no other income. It's always two or more people in a family working on the pottery business, and usually splitting up to do two shows on the same weekend. Always all functional pots.
So, I have always thought of my being a potter as a respectable job (business) , but it is a lower paying one.
If money was the real driving force I would have selected something else when I was eighteen and decided to do this. Or I would have switched by now.
Still making pots,
Judy Rohrbaugh
Fine Art Stoneware
Ohio
Craig Clark wrote:
I generally refer to myself as a full time potter but I am
definitely in the low end of the range, acutally less, that has been
described. It is my spousal unit who acts as the "sponser of sorts" with
the job that provides the medical insurance. If we were to try and by
insurance privately it would cost us upwards of $800/month with a family
of four for decent coverage around here.
steve graber on fri 20 jan 06
i gotta say full time pottery is a great lifestyle if you can maintain it for several years or life.
in 1994 i lost my *real* job along with many engieners in so cal. single income family for me - wife with disability. no sponsor! i knew ahead of time that if you had a degree you could be a substitue teacher. so i was a sub - usually 2 to 3 days a week, sometimes zero. i did some contract engineering work also. when not doing "traditional" stuff i did pottery. i threw the best ever back in 1994 & 1995!
got a "real" job again in late 1995. RIGHT at the cross roads of saying screw it on engineering too....
i did backyard *pot parties* which WERE starting to take off so what mel says is very real valuable advice. one weekend every october. free soda, hot dogs, burgers. near 100% of who ever shows up buys. ~ they feel guilty for getting free food & buy something? should have also added a day in march. (remember, southern california in march is actually summer).
i got calls for three years after maintaining full time pottery for leads i wasn't able to maintain later. word of mouth is real! it works!
looking back, my business *plan* was screwed up. i was thinking i could do the typical ca\raft shows & art shows. but there were really only 6 to 8 shows a year where i'd get decent sales. just not that many shows around the area, and i felt travel costs would make distance shows net-zero.
i also thought i'd provide this wide matrix of products & colors. in the end i should have maintained maybe two colors - and forget about people saying "do you have a mug like this in green?" same with so many sizes i offered of the products.
i also saw & didn't act on the fact that while i like making vases, i'd only sell maybe 3 to 6 a weekend. for me too much fuss to bring the full batch of vases i had. ~ should have just brought a few nice teaser vases!
i saw & didn't act on the fact that people liked my larger bowls. while i was selling them for $85 to $120, i'd only have maybe 5 to 7 for any one show. i was always out! i should have simply made more! ~ or charge more AND make more!
so, from what i went thru, it's not easy & you have to be clear headed or astute to review your product matrix & act on what sells & what doesn't. ~ forget about making a sale to those people who scan your booth for 30 minutes only to select (or not) a mug!
see ya
steve
Judy Rohrbaugh wrote: I think like Craig. I have always thought of myself as a fulltime potter, but I am the second income, my husband is the main breadwinner with the benefits. If I wasn't doing this, and had another job, I'm sure it wouldn't pay much, knowing my personality, and what type of work I would select.
There are a lot of "second income" jobs. Many families have one main income, then the second one, The second one is neccessary even if it is lower than the primary one.
There are some potters that I meet at the art shows that do this with no other income. It's always two or more people in a family working on the pottery business, and usually splitting up to do two shows on the same weekend. Always all functional pots.
So, I have always thought of my being a potter as a respectable job (business) , but it is a lower paying one.
If money was the real driving force I would have selected something else when I was eighteen and decided to do this. Or I would have switched by now.
Still making pots,
Judy Rohrbaugh
Fine Art Stoneware
Ohio
Craig Clark wrote:
I generally refer to myself as a full time potter but I am
definitely in the low end of the range, acutally less, that has been
described. It is my spousal unit who acts as the "sponser of sorts" with
the job that provides the medical insurance. If we were to try and by
insurance privately it would cost us upwards of $800/month with a family
of four for decent coverage around here.
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
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Lee Love on fri 20 jan 06
On 2006/01/20 7:54:39, hmurrow@efn.org wrote:
> I can make no claims for $$$ success, but I have observed that it takes
> about 1000 families in one's 'neighborhood' to make a decent living.
> That is, a 50 mile radius. Do you have 1000 adventurous and/or
> sophisticated families within 50 mile radius?
The big problem here in Mashiko, is that you have about 1000 potters in
a 2 mile radius. :-( Nobody can make money here, just selling to
their neighbors. Funny thing here, sometimes, when Jean tries to buy
a pot from a Mashiko potter, they will say, "Ask your husband to make
it for you" then they give her the pot for free.
Financially, it would be easier for me in the Twin Cities.
I remember a few years back at an Jeff Oestrich workshop.
He said he made closer to the bottom of Tae Kim's range (said he made
the same wages as the local school bus driver.) Helped me have a
realistic perspective on money to hear this from an internationally
known potter. Sometimes, a day job makes a lot of sense.
--
Lee Love
in Mashiko, Japan http://mashiko.org
http://seisokuro.blogspot.com/ My Photo Logs
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication."
--Leonardo da Vinci
Eric Serritella on fri 20 jan 06
Yes, it is possible, and certainly a lot of work. I left an advertising exec
job after 16 years. I work harder now than ever before and make less money.
But I do make a living and my quality of life is better. My commute is 6
steps from house to studio.
Someone else on this thread (I forget who - sorry) mentioned that it's a
business, and needs to be run like one. That's true. It's not a game. It can
be fun. Very fun. (I'll take it over a day at the desk anytime). But it is a
business. And what I've found works for me, as is true with many business
models, is to stay diverse. Not necessarily diverse in what I make, as too
many looks from one place can confuse the consumer, but in how I bring the
pots to market. Don't have all your eggs in one basket as they say. This
way, if any one basket breaks, it's not devastating.
So I include a variety of selling methods...wholesale to stores, art/craft
shows (both large and small), I teach in my studio when no one is buying
pots during the Upstate NY winters, I travel to do workshops, show in
galleries,sell out of my studio, find grant opportunities, etc. And I look
for exposure opportunities locally and nationally, from the "Ithaca Times"
to "Ceramic Monthly". How much effort I put into each area varies as the
market and economy change. I used to make the bulk of my living doing
art/craft shows. They've been really down the last few years and a few
wholesale accounts have really taken off, so they get more attention from me
now. But that won't last forever. So stay flexible while staying true to
yourself and the work you want to make.
Find your niche and locate the people that fit it. I actually have what one
might consider two "lines". I make production pots (mugs, etc.) and also
one-of-a-kind higher priced pieces. They are marketed to two different
groups. In fact I identify them differently. Call it branding if you will.
The production work is from Muddy Paws Pottery. Catchy. Easy for the
consumer to remember when they want more. The collector pieces are from Eric
Serritella. Collectors are interested in the artist. Who he or she is.
There are lots of ways to "make it work", and certainly this isn't the only
approach, but it is one that I've found has kept me above water. Sometimes
barely, but I have managed to stay afloat.
Eric
Muddy Paws Pottery
528 Sebring Road
Newfield, NY 14867
607.564.7810
www.muddypawspottery.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tae Kim"
To:
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 3:29 PM
Subject: career in pottery
Hi everyone
I had a question to everyone who makes a living (20k - 100K) doing pottery.
I have always been curious as to how big the market actually is for all of
us potters. I have been doing ceramics for a while now, but I never sold
anything, but am thinking about going in a direction where I would like to
make it my "career". However, I always doubted that the market that
purchases the pottery would be big enough for another career potter. Is this
true? In a life time, people make thousands and thousands of item, and how
can there possibly be enough people to purchase all of them, especially with
so may potters around everywhere, as this forum shows.
I am just trying to make a sense outta this profession at this post
industrial time. Only very few would use pottery as their main dishware and
if people did purchase a pottery, it would be just a novelty item for them,
no?
I know one guy who actually makes good money selling his stuff in my area,
but thats just one person.
What do you guys all think?
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Eleanora Eden on sat 21 jan 06
I just read all the varied replies so I'll add just a coupla thoughts
since I'm trying to get OUTA HERE for my winter selling trip.
There are SO NOT a thousand families in my neighborhood in the market
for my stuff. I travel far and wide to find my customer: Ann Arbor,
Cherry Creek, Florida.
NH league and Vermont's Frog Hollow are my base galleries, and the
annual NH league fair my biggest fair. But for the other half of our
annual income we travel. Gives us a chance to get out and see the
sights and we like it. We're also slowly getting better at doing it.
Our family income was exclusively my pottery til about 5 years ago
when I added glass jewelry, so I have more customers and a more
varied work life and it works for us. My spouse is all the support,
mechanical, webpage doer, makes it all possible.
I think that most people including me would prefer to have a steady,
reliable income. But the thing I was good at was pots and so that
was that. By the time it was time to look for a teaching job I was
happier in the studio.
Please, everybody, do a not-rain dance so that the rain either comes
earlier or later in Key West....next weekend is my fair and the
prognosis is for the only rain in sight to be on those 2 days....so
that is a good indication of the iffi-ness of making a living at the
fairs. The weather is such a big influence on the earnings.
But I wouldn't change any of it now....and for the 20K-100K thing:
expenses are HUGE. So it depends how you're talking. I think most
people talk gross income which has little relationship to a paycheck.
Eleanora
steve graber on sat 21 jan 06
while i only attempted full time pottery for 2 years, it was interesting come tax time to see that my whole lifestyle became a tax write off. miles on the car were usually going "somewhere" pottery releated & the studio was 20% of the home so that was 20% of a lot of home expenses, etc.
in the end my net taxable income was low, but i covered my expenses, had a fine christmas, made the IRA deposits, etc. so, is that so bad? seemed to actually be a perfect business - live well & pay low taxes!
see ya
steve
....and for the 20K-100K thing:expenses are HUGE. So it depends how you're talking. I think mostpeople talk gross income which has little relationship to a paycheck.
Eleanora Eden wrote: I just read all the varied replies so I'll add just a coupla thoughts
since I'm trying to get OUTA HERE for my winter selling trip.
There are SO NOT a thousand families in my neighborhood in the market
for my stuff. I travel far and wide to find my customer: Ann Arbor,
Cherry Creek, Florida.
NH league and Vermont's Frog Hollow are my base galleries, and the
annual NH league fair my biggest fair. But for the other half of our
annual income we travel. Gives us a chance to get out and see the
sights and we like it. We're also slowly getting better at doing it.
Our family income was exclusively my pottery til about 5 years ago
when I added glass jewelry, so I have more customers and a more
varied work life and it works for us. My spouse is all the support,
mechanical, webpage doer, makes it all possible.
I think that most people including me would prefer to have a steady,
reliable income. But the thing I was good at was pots and so that
was that. By the time it was time to look for a teaching job I was
happier in the studio.
Please, everybody, do a not-rain dance so that the rain either comes
earlier or later in Key West....next weekend is my fair and the
prognosis is for the only rain in sight to be on those 2 days....so
that is a good indication of the iffi-ness of making a living at the
fairs. The weather is such a big influence on the earnings.
But I wouldn't change any of it now....and for the 20K-100K thing:
expenses are HUGE. So it depends how you're talking. I think most
people talk gross income which has little relationship to a paycheck.
Eleanora
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Terri Kennedy on mon 23 jan 06
I've been reading the responses to this thread and decided to put my 2 cents
worth in. I have a friend that is a potter and a single mom and has been
supporting herself and her son, for over 12 years, on just her income from
her pottery. She does not sell wholesale and doesn't have her stuff in any
shops, but only sells her pottery at local art markets and festivals. Even
though she lives in a very small town, the "50 mile" radius is working very
well for her. So I think that it can be done, this potter is living proof.
Thanks,
Terri Kennedy
Denham Springs, LA
http://www.potterristudio.com
*Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult.
Randall Moody on tue 24 jan 06
I have been toying with the idea of going "full time" as a potter myself.
(Time to put the degree to work.) But I have had a very hard time finding
business plans for a potter. Does anyone know of a source. I have them for
"paint your own" type of things and graphic artists but no specific "potter=
"
sample. I suppose I could convert the graphic artists' plan to my needs if =
I
must.
steve graber on tue 24 jan 06
i think it's important to work up your own business plan v finding one around somewhere. the point of the business plan, is to PLAN the business. make it something you truly understand.
there are "blank" business plans you can buy at software stores. they walk you thru the process of developing a business plan - for most any business' - much like the software for filling out your taxes.
while finding one matching what you want to do is useful for review, the process of building the business plan is needed to get the actual business started successfully as well.
see ya
steve
Randall Moody wrote: I have been toying with the idea of going "full time" as a potter myself.
(Time to put the degree to work.) But I have had a very hard time finding
business plans for a potter. Does anyone know of a source. I have them for
"paint your own" type of things and graphic artists but no specific "potter"
sample. I suppose I could convert the graphic artists' plan to my needs if I
must.
______________________________________________________________________________
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Randall Moody on tue 24 jan 06
I agree. I wasn't wanting to use someone else's for my own plan but rather
to look at it as more of a template. The problem I have found is that most
of the plans easily found in the software are so general or so far removed
from pottery as to be useless.
One of my biggest gripes with art school is they teach you how to make boat
loads of art but never how to sell it.
On 1/24/06, steve graber wrote:
>
> i think it's important to work up your own business plan v finding one
> around somewhere. the point of the business plan, is to PLAN the
> business. make it something you truly understand.
>
m.mshelomi on wed 25 jan 06
Randall... Do not know where you are so am not so sure how my ideas would
work.
Lots of business schools have alums that work within the school and with
state/federal small business departments. They help with business plans,
can point the way to backers, loans, federal and state monies...
AARP has all sorts of services that it offers to folks who want to write a
business plan. They, like the retired business people mentioned above, have
worked in the real world and can give invaluable information.
Then there is the Small Business Administration. Good people there but,
usually have been in the employee of government their whole working lives.
They have read all the books but, not really experienced what goes on in
this world.
There may be a group of CPAs' or...??? Ask around and call anyone that
seems like they might give you a hand... Ohhh... United Way does a lot of
work with business and the public... All they can say is no and then you
are out only a phone call or letter.
pottermim off for the night time meander with the dogs
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randall Moody"
To:
Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2006 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: career in pottery
I have been toying with the idea of going "full time" as a potter myself.
(Time to put the degree to work.) But I have had a very hard time finding
business plans for a potter. Does anyone know of a source. I have them for
"paint your own" type of things and graphic artists but no specific "potter"
sample. I suppose I could convert the graphic artists' plan to my needs if I
must.
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Randall Moody on thu 26 jan 06
I just wanted to tell everyone thanks for the insight and ideas! I have
decided to keep working at the local arts center to build up some capital
before moving into an actual brick and morter place. I have found a few guy=
s
from my church who are willing to help and mentor me on the business end of
things. Now I just have to get off my dead arse and make things!.
Randall
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