mel jacobson on wed 24 may 06
nils lou at linfield college in oregon had that kiln
blow on him as he was just moving away from
checking it.
it was one advancer in the kiln...only one. the others
were standard shelves. they have no idea how it got
wet. perhaps a student was cleaning it, and left it in
the rain. no one will know. just an accident.
in fact...(see my website, clayart page) the door was
free stacked and he said it was like a frost plug,
the door blew across the room. it is, of course, a
flat top, and about four bricks popped up about six inches.
all he has to do is loosen the rods and tap them back in place.
kiln will be fine after some simple repairs. he said there is absolutely
no evidence of that shelf remaining. just dust and tiny shards. that sumbich
really blow'd up good.
he feels very lucky.
nils also, while returning to mcminnville from the airport
the other night at 2 a.m. fell asleep at the wheel and
went into the median, was unhurt and only had the
car scratched up a good deal. his seat belt was on tight and
the car did not roll.
so, he just used a couple of his cat lives.
you will note if you look at the picture, that nils is making
single walled kilns. that kiln is one of them. fire fast, efficiently,
and it makes little difference as you are done before the bricks
can even got hot on the outside face.
hmmmm, interesting...based on our conversations on electric kilns
and extra insulation. that kiln is sprayed with itc, and has the
reflective quality of a hard brick kiln inside. it is much the same as our
little kilns at the farm....we fire in 4.5 hours to cone 12. the outside
of the kiln is not even warm.
we talked at great length this morning about fire down, reduce down.
the more we talked, the more excited he got....and you can bet
he will be trying it with his students. probably in that kiln that
blew.
i am sorry, i have no technical expertise to tell anyone how it works or why.
i have theories, but not statistical evidence...like always, i observe.
and what i observe is great pots, nice color, and great clay color.
mel
from: mel/minnetonka.mn.usa
website: http://my.pclink.com/~melpots3
Tom at Hutchtel.net on thu 25 may 06
Subject: blown kiln
> nils lou at linfield college in oregon had that kiln
> blow on him as he was just moving away from
> checking it.
>
> it was one advancer in the kiln...only one. the others
> were standard shelves. they have no idea how it got
> wet. perhaps a student was cleaning it, and left it in
We switched to advancers about a year ago and have had no problems....BUT WE
WERE WARNED! Smith-Sharpe had clearly told us of the issue about moisture.
We had also seen, shortly before, Bill Campbell's big electric, blown to
smithereens. Unbelievable. Tragedy averted only because his helpers were,
just by chance, behind his new (at that time) gas kiln when it blew. Bricks
were 50 feet away and the entire kiln was rubble (this is a large electric,
I might add).
When we got the advancers, I stacked them in one of the electric kilns, well
separated by posts and away from t he coils, and cooked them gently on one
switch low overnight. Don't know if it was overkill, but we've had now
problems.
The point is, it's not just if they get water on them, it is just as likely
if they are set on a damp floor for awhile. No apparent moisture, but it is
internalized. Smith-Sharpe was warning us that just sitting in a cold damp
warehouse was enough. We keep ours on a wooden cart on wheels up off the
concrete. In soggy ole Oregon, I suspect it would be easy to get the
necessary humidity. Glad Nils was fine.
Tom Wirt
Hutchinson, MN
twirt@hutchtel.net
www.claycoyote.com
Randall Moody on thu 25 may 06
My question is if the risk is worth the reward when using Advancer shelves.
What are the benefits when weighed against the possibility of having them
explode? I am not pro nor con on this issue but rather curious.
On 5/25/06, Tom at Hutchtel.net wrote:
>
> Subject: blown kiln
>
>
> > nils lou at linfield college in oregon had that kiln
> > blow on him as he was just moving away from
> > checking it.
> >
> > it was one advancer in the kiln...only one. the others
> > were standard shelves. they have no idea how it got
> > wet. perhaps a student was cleaning it, and left it in
>
>
> We switched to advancers about a year ago and have had no problems....BUT
> WE
> WERE WARNED! Smith-Sharpe had clearly told us of the issue about
> moisture.
> We had also seen, shortly before, Bill Campbell's big electric, blown to
> smithereens. Unbelievable. Tragedy averted only because his helpers
> were,
> just by chance, behind his new (at that time) gas kiln when it
> blew. Bricks
> were 50 feet away and the entire kiln was rubble (this is a large
> electric,
> I might add).
>
> When we got the advancers, I stacked them in one of the electric kilns,
> well
> separated by posts and away from t he coils, and cooked them gently on on=
e
> switch low overnight. Don't know if it was overkill, but we've had now
> problems.
>
> The point is, it's not just if they get water on them, it is just as
> likely
> if they are set on a damp floor for awhile. No apparent moisture, but it
> is
> internalized. Smith-Sharpe was warning us that just sitting in a cold
> damp
> warehouse was enough. We keep ours on a wooden cart on wheels up off the
> concrete. In soggy ole Oregon, I suspect it would be easy to get the
> necessary humidity. Glad Nils was fine.
>
> Tom Wirt
> Hutchinson, MN
> twirt@hutchtel.net
> www.claycoyote.com
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________________=
_____
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
Hank Murrow on thu 25 may 06
On May 25, 2006, Tom Wirt wrote:
>
> When we got the advancers, I stacked them in one of the electric
> kilns, well
> separated by posts and away from t he coils, and cooked them gently on
> one
> switch low overnight. Don't know if it was overkill, but we've had now
> problems.
Dear Tom:
One can place a 25 watt bulb under the cabinet where the Advancers are
kept. Even in soggy oregon, they will stay nice and dry. Good point
about concrete floors allowing moisture wicking.
Cheers, Hank
www.murrow.biz/hank
Norman Aufrichtig on thu 25 may 06
i use advancer shelves in my electric kilns, lots of advantages
take up less mass in the kiln,easier on the kiln, faster firings even with
controlled cooling, my firings are very even, i use digital controllers but
the kiln fires more evenly with the advancers, glazes don't stick to the
shelves- no kilnwash., light easy to use, more packing space, they don't
warp or crack are very strong things happen, but never had one even chip.
i do live in the dry west, new mexico, but i am also very careful not to let
them get wet, keep them off the ground, they are expensive, cost as much as
the kiln, i treat them with care. my kilns are indoors. if i was firing
outdoors, would still get them and would find some way to protect them.
norman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randall Moody"
To:
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2006 9:53 AM
Subject: Re: [CLAYART] blown kiln
My question is if the risk is worth the reward when using Advancer shelves.
What are the benefits when weighed against the possibility of having them
explode? I am not pro nor con on this issue but rather curious.
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.7.1/347 - Release Date: 5/24/2006
William & Susan Schran User on thu 25 may 06
On 5/25/06 11:53 AM, "Randall Moody" wrote:
> My question is if the risk is worth the reward when using Advancer shelves.
> What are the benefits when weighed against the possibility of having them
> explode? I am not pro nor con on this issue but rather curious.
Last fall I presented at Lattice Structures in Kansas City.
I fellow presenter, Bill Campbell, had his studio badly damaged by fire some
time ago. He rebuilt and salvaged some shelves from the fire.
One Advancer shelf, that had gotten wet from putting out the fire, was in a
big L&L Davinci kiln. Apparently that shelf had not dried out completely and
exploded, utterly destroying the kiln. Bill showed slides of the
destruction. Had anyone be near the kiln at the time of the explosion, they
would have been killed.
We were using high alumina and old silicon carbide shelves in our 24 cu. Ft.
Geil kiln, just started firing this new kiln a few weeks after the
conference. After a few firings, I got really tired of hefting those heavy
12" x 24" up to my shoulder level and above.
I thought long and hard about the nitride bonded shelves given all the
issues about them exploding if wet. Our kiln is in a non-conditioned
building outside, but is covered and kept dry. I had a long conversation
with the folks at Kilnshelf.com and felt easier about ordering some.
We got 10 Advancer shelves and used them along with our other old shelves.
In a school situation, one would expect mistakes from students. Glaze runs &
drips happen. With our old alumina shelves I had to chisel and grind, often
taking out chunks of shelving. With silicon carbide shelves I also had to
chisel and grind, though the shelves were not chipped, they did warp.
With the Advancer shelves, glaze drips come off with a putty knife - no more
chiseling. A quick once over with the angle grinder cleans it right up. We
had one student, who dropped the class, give his leftover clay to a couple
fellow students. He had purchased low fire clay! When the clay was fired to
^10, you can imagine what happened - melted, dripping clay on the shelves
and down on the floor of the kiln. I was able to chip out the melted clay
from the kiln floor without losing too much brick. Where the clay melted on
alumina & silicon carbide shelves - lots of chiseling and grinding. Melted
clay on the Advancer shelves came right off with a putty knife.
The next day I ordered 10 more Advancer shelves.
Don't let them get wet, don't use any kiln wash and they'll last and last.
-- William "Bill" Schran
Fredericksburg, Virginia
wschran@cox.net
wschran@nvcc.edu
Rikki Gill on thu 25 may 06
Hi Randall
I don't see any risk if you accept that they need to be stored inside, and
handled gently. Mine are probably 7-8 years old, with no problems. Not one
crack, no bending.
I think water / moisture is the only problem I have heard about. When you
think about warped ware on warped shelves, or a sore back they really seem a
bargain.
Good luck,
Rikki
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randall Moody"
To:
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2006 8:53 AM
Subject: Re: blown kiln
My question is if the risk is worth the reward when using Advancer shelves.
What are the benefits when weighed against the possibility of having them
explode? I am not pro nor con on this issue but rather curious.
On 5/25/06, Tom at Hutchtel.net wrote:
>
> Subject: blown kiln
>
>
> > nils lou at linfield college in oregon had that kiln
> > blow on him as he was just moving away from
> > checking it.
> >
> > it was one advancer in the kiln...only one. the others
> > were standard shelves. they have no idea how it got
> > wet. perhaps a student was cleaning it, and left it in
>
>
> We switched to advancers about a year ago and have had no problems....BUT
> WE
> WERE WARNED! Smith-Sharpe had clearly told us of the issue about
> moisture.
> We had also seen, shortly before, Bill Campbell's big electric, blown to
> smithereens. Unbelievable. Tragedy averted only because his helpers
> were,
> just by chance, behind his new (at that time) gas kiln when it
> blew. Bricks
> were 50 feet away and the entire kiln was rubble (this is a large
> electric,
> I might add).
>
> When we got the advancers, I stacked them in one of the electric kilns,
> well
> separated by posts and away from t he coils, and cooked them gently on one
> switch low overnight. Don't know if it was overkill, but we've had now
> problems.
>
> The point is, it's not just if they get water on them, it is just as
> likely
> if they are set on a damp floor for awhile. No apparent moisture, but it
> is
> internalized. Smith-Sharpe was warning us that just sitting in a cold
> damp
> warehouse was enough. We keep ours on a wooden cart on wheels up off the
> concrete. In soggy ole Oregon, I suspect it would be easy to get the
> necessary humidity. Glad Nils was fine.
>
> Tom Wirt
> Hutchinson, MN
> twirt@hutchtel.net
> www.claycoyote.com
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
> You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
> settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
> Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
> melpots@pclink.com.
>
______________________________________________________________________________
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.7.0/345 - Release Date: 5/22/2006
Tom at Hutchtel.net on thu 25 may 06
We happened up to Kevin Caufield's on Mother's day and he was showing us his
Advancers that he has had for at least 10-12 years. I know he had had them
for a number of years when Haymow held their Ron Roy workshop at his studio,
what, 7 or 8 years ago?
Tom Wirt
Paul Herman on thu 25 may 06
hello All,
I use a few Advancers in my gas kiln. They're working fine. I live in
a low humidity desert.
A question comes to mind about the kiln in which the Advancer
exploded. Was it set for a "four-hours-to-cone-ten" firing cycle? If
so, perhaps that could be partly or wholly to blame.
best,
Paul Herman
Great Basin Pottery
Doyle, California US
http://greatbasinpottery.com
On May 25, 2006, at 8:53 AM, Randall Moody wrote:
> My question is if the risk is worth the reward when using Advancer
> shelves.
> What are the benefits when weighed against the possibility of
> having them
> explode? I am not pro nor con on this issue but rather curious.
>
| |
|
