Stephanie Albright on mon 13 nov 06
First off, THANK YOU. I am new to Clayart but have found tons of info
that I desparately need. I just picked up my first kiln today. My mother
and grandmother used to have a little ceramics shop. The bought two Duncan
kilns from a Duncan dealer. I am starting with the small one: a DK 820-2.
The kiln has been in my grandmother's basement and has not been used in
YEARS. No paperwork but I wrote everything off the kiln down. It says:
serial AO1 703, Volts 220-240, AMP 24, Cone 8, AC single phase, max temp
2345. It has a Dawson Kiln Sitter Model LT-3K with 230 VAC- 45 amps 60 Hz.
What I intend to use it for is hand built sculptures between 1/4-1/2 inch
minimum/maximum thickness made from Amaco VersaClay (cone 04-06) and Amaco
Porcelain Clay (cone 5) as prescribed. The only manual I could find was on
Paragon's website and they have one manual (pdf) for Duncan kilns. The
manual is a general manual for use and care of a Duncan but does not
specifically list the DK series; just several other models.
Now the questions start flying. My garage (huge 6 car Morton building)
is only wired for 110 so that is out until I can afford to have line run
to it for the kiln. My basement is concrete with limestone walls, 8 foot
ceiling and is set up for 220. I see a lot of threads from people using
kilns in their homes, Do I just need heat shielding on the ceiling or
everywhere? I am assuming I would need to install some type of kiln vent
also. Is there any way to get around spending $400.00 on ventilation? Does
the "220-240" on the kiln mean it will run on either? The general Duncan
manual only mentions 240. The power cord itself seems in great shape, no
cracks or dryness. The edges of the prongs for the plug are kind of
corroded (not the ground prong though). Should I replace the whole cord or
clean off the corrosion and use? The other question about the cord assumes
that I can use 220. IF that is the case, On this particular plug model the
two main prongs are horizontal not at an angle like my home outlet for the
220...can I change the cord to one that fits?
Then there is the stand. The pdf manual says the kilns need at least 12"
of clearance. The original stand is only 8 1/2" tall! The stand looks too
rusty to trust but the steel plate under the kiln has minimal rust. Should
I order one from somewhere or can I use spaced cement blocks that do not
exceed the plate? What about the disparity in height?
The manual does give detailed testing of all of the components and
troubleshooting. The kiln overall visually seems to be in uesable shape.
Very clean INSIDE, no corrosion, rust, crumbling, flaking or even dust.
The OUTSIDE has a some spottings of rust here and there, but surface only.
The bricks are fine as are the lid and base. The control box has more
surface rust, but I have not checked the guts of it yet. That may be
another story. I may finally get it plugged in and nothing works!
Have I lost my mind yet? I think I may be close. The sitter "prongs"
have a little kiln wash on the tip, but I understand that should be there
during use, should I chip it off or leave alone; do I need to apply kiln
wash to every sitter cone every time? AND do I need to use kiln wash on
the shelves if I am only bisque firing. No glazing. (Once I am comfortable
with producing, I may give it a shot, but for now it is just going to be
acrylic.
Don't ask why, but I thought that I could just plug it in and go. Any
answers in whole or in part would be much appreciated!!! ~~ Steph
Bruce Girrell on mon 13 nov 06
Stephanie Albright wrote:
> Is there any way to get around spending $400.00 on ventilation?
How much is running power to the garage going to cost? Wouldn't this $400 be
better applied to that cost, rather than paying now and paying again later?
> Does the "220-240" on the kiln mean it will run on either?
Yes. The voltage spec is only nominal. Anything in that range will be OK.
That being said, however, remember that there is no free lunch. A lower
voltage at the kiln means that the kiln will have less power.
> The edges of the prongs for the plug are kind of
> corroded (not the ground prong though).
> Should I replace the whole cord or clean off the corrosion and use?
Just clean it up. When the kiln gets a permanent home, consider cutting the
plug off and wiring directly in a junction box.
The other question about the cord assumes
> that I can use 220. IF that is the case, On this particular plug model the
> two main prongs are horizontal not at an angle like my home outlet for the
> 220...can I change the cord to one that fits?
Please refer to this chart (courtesy of Sheffield Pottery):
http://www.sheffield-pottery.com/Articles.asp?ID=127
The pin configuration on your plug/outlet is not just some manufacturer's
whim. The arrangement of the pins indicates a specific voltage and current
rating. Please note that the chart uses numbers like 125 volts and 250
volts. These numbers refer to _maximum_ values, not nominal. Also, please be
aware that the drawings are not to scale. They depict only the arrangement,
not the physical size of the connectors.
If you look at the chart you will see that the horizontal connector
configuration is used for a 30 amp connection and the angled connector
configuration is used for a 20 amp connection. Your kiln, which is rated to
draw 24 amperes, requires a 30 ampere connection.
Good luck - and be safe
Bruce Girrell
Pamela Regentin on mon 13 nov 06
I'll let the kiln experts tackle some of the technical questions but here are a few of my thoughts:
Do NOT ruin your shelves with kiln wash if you are not using glazes. Why in the world should you?? Your shelves and kiln will last longer without it.
I don't know about any one else, but I have never put kiln wash on sitter cones or on the prong and never had a problem that way.
The factory stand is fine on a concrete floor. Most code requires 36" of clearance from walls and objects though and that doesn't refer to clearance from the floor.
I've known many people with kilns in their basements and no ventilation (including my former teacher, a nationally known ceramic artist who fired to cone 10) but I think you'll probably get some good venting advice from someone else.
DO NOT change the angled prong plug on the cord. You need to have an appropriate outlet wired in by a professional so that it goes directly to your breaker box and so that the kiln has its own breaker. Depending on the distance (the shorter the better) to your breaker box, it may not cost more than $100. If your breaker box is in the garage, definately put the kiln out there too. My son is an electrical apprentice and is helping with my rewire. He said the cord costs about $3.50 a foot. Also, I think you can sand the corrosion off the plug if the rest of the cord is in good shape.
Good luck Stephanie! It will get easier as you go.
Pam
My garage (huge 6 car Morton building)
is only wired for 110 so that is out until I can afford to have line run
to it for the kiln. My basement is concrete with limestone walls, 8 foot
ceiling and is set up for 220. I see a lot of threads from people using
kilns in their homes, Do I just need heat shielding on the ceiling or
everywhere? I am assuming I would need to install some type of kiln vent
also. Is there any way to get around spending $400.00 on ventilation? Does
the "220-240" on the kiln mean it will run on either? The general Duncan
manual only mentions 240. The power cord itself seems in great shape, no
cracks or dryness. The edges of the prongs for the plug are kind of
corroded (not the ground prong though). Should I replace the whole cord or
clean off the corrosion and use? The other question about the cord assumes
that I can use 220. IF that is the case, On this particular plug model the
two main prongs are horizontal not at an angle like my home outlet for the
220...can I change the cord to one that fits?
Then there is the stand. The pdf manual says the kilns need at least 12"
of clearance. The original stand is only 8 1/2" tall! The stand looks too
rusty to trust but the steel plate under the kiln has minimal rust. Should
I order one from somewhere or can I use spaced cement blocks that do not
exceed the plate? What about the disparity in height?
The sitter "prongs"
have a little kiln wash on the tip, but I understand that should be there
during use, should I chip it off or leave alone; do I need to apply kiln
wash to every sitter cone every time? AND do I need to use kiln wash on
the shelves if I am only bisque firing. No glazing.
---------------------------------
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Arnold Howard on mon 13 nov 06
Steph, the DK series were Duncan's first kilns. They are
simple and reliable. You should download both the Duncan
Service Manual and the Duncan DK, DB & DA Kiln Owner's
Manual from Paragon's website:
http://www.paragonweb.com/Instruction_Manuals.cfm
Since you will be firing the DK-820-2 in your basement, I
recommend the downdraft kiln vent. It is ultimately worth
the price, because it will prevent fumes from entering your
living area.
If you are in the United States, your wiring is 240 volts
rather than 220.
The plug is probably safe to use if it shows no signs of
heat damage.
Since the cord does not match the wall outlet, you should
have an electrician change the outlet. He will know if the
circuit wire gauge is heavy enough for the kiln's amperage.
The recommended 12" of clearance around the kiln means 12"
on the sides and back. It doesn't mean 12" under the kiln.
You should remove flammable materials from the kiln room.
The kiln stand should also be on a concrete floor.
I would order another stand to replace the rusted one. I
know that people successfully support kilns with cinder
blocks, but I prefer the stand. It gives better air
circulation under the kiln--and air is an excellent
insulator. Bricks can also change the heat distribution by
pulling heat out of the kiln.
The Kiln Sitter cone supports should have a thin coat of
kiln wash. This prevents the cone from sticking and
overfiring the kiln. You do not need to remove the old kiln
wash unless it builds up too heavily on the supports.
You can slide the cone supports out of the porcelain tube to
examine them more closely.
Keep a nail polish bottle of kiln wash nearby and recoat the
supports with every firing. But do not apply kiln wash to
the cone. Allow the kiln wash to dry before inserting the
cone.
I would apply kiln wash to the shelves and the kiln bottom
even if you are not going to fire glazes. Suppose you fired
a low-fire clay thinking it was high fire? It would melt all
over your shelves. I've also seen the self-supporting
witness cones stick to bare shelves.
Your mother and grandmother took good care of that kiln. It
should last many years.
Sincerely,
Arnold Howard
Paragon Industries, L.P., Mesquite, Texas USA
ahoward@paragonweb.com / www.paragonweb.com
From: "Stephanie Albright"
My mother
> and grandmother used to have a little ceramics shop. The
> bought two Duncan
> kilns from a Duncan dealer. I am starting with the small
> one: a DK 820-2.
I see a lot of threads from people using
> kilns in their homes, Do I just need heat shielding on the
> ceiling or
> everywhere? I am assuming I would need to install some
> type of kiln vent
> also. Is there any way to get around spending $400.00 on
> ventilation? Does
> the "220-240" on the kiln mean it will run on either? The
> general Duncan
> manual only mentions 240. The power cord itself seems in
> great shape, no
> cracks or dryness. The edges of the prongs for the plug
> are kind of
> corroded (not the ground prong though). Should I replace
> the whole cord or
> clean off the corrosion and use? The other question about
> the cord assumes
> that I can use 220. IF that is the case, On this
> particular plug model the
> two main prongs are horizontal not at an angle like my
> home outlet for the
> 220...can I change the cord to one that fits?
> Then there is the stand. The pdf manual says the kilns
> need at least 12"
> of clearance. The original stand is only 8 1/2" tall! The
> stand looks too
> rusty to trust but the steel plate under the kiln has
> minimal rust. Should
> I order one from somewhere or can I use spaced cement
> blocks that do not
> exceed the plate? What about the disparity in height?
> The manual does give detailed testing of all of the
> components and
> troubleshooting. The kiln overall visually seems to be in
> uesable shape.
> Very clean INSIDE, no corrosion, rust, crumbling, flaking
> or even dust.
> The OUTSIDE has a some spottings of rust here and there,
> but surface only.
> The bricks are fine as are the lid and base. The control
> box has more
> surface rust, but I have not checked the guts of it yet.
> That may be
> another story. I may finally get it plugged in and nothing
> works!
> Have I lost my mind yet? I think I may be close. The
> sitter "prongs"
> have a little kiln wash on the tip, but I understand that
> should be there
> during use, should I chip it off or leave alone; do I need
> to apply kiln
> wash to every sitter cone every time? AND do I need to use
> kiln wash on
> the shelves if I am only bisque firing. No glazing.
Arnold Howard on mon 13 nov 06
From: "Pamela Regentin"
> I have never put kiln wash on sitter cones or on the
> prong and never had a problem that way.
Some of the cones form a glassy surface that sticks to new
Kiln Sitter cone supports. Once this happens, the Kiln
Sitter will not shut off until either the cone gets so hot
that it drips out of the cone supports, or the Limit Timer
trips.
This may happen only with new cone supports--I'm not sure.
After a few firings, an oxide forms on the supports.
At any rate, to be on the safe side, kiln manufacturers
recommend coating the top of the cone supports and the
bottom of the actuating rod. You can remove the supports for
a closer examination. If the kiln wash coating is in good
condition, then you don't need to add another coat.
Sincerely,
Arnold Howard
Paragon Industries, L.P., Mesquite, Texas USA
ahoward@paragonweb.com / www.paragonweb.com
Stephanie Albright on tue 14 nov 06
On Mon, 13 Nov 2006 10:41:44 -0500, Bruce Girrell
wrote:
>Stephanie Albright wrote:
>> Is there any way to get around spending $400.00 on ventilation?
>
>How much is running power to the garage going to cost? Wouldn't this $400
be
>better applied to that cost, rather than paying now and paying again
later?
>
>> Does the "220-240" on the kiln mean it will run on either?
>
>Yes. The voltage spec is only nominal. Anything in that range will be OK.
>That being said, however, remember that there is no free lunch. A lower
>voltage at the kiln means that the kiln will have less power.
>
>> The edges of the prongs for the plug are kind of
>> corroded (not the ground prong though).
>> Should I replace the whole cord or clean off the corrosion and use?
>
>Just clean it up. When the kiln gets a permanent home, consider cutting
the
>plug off and wiring directly in a junction box.
>
>
>The other question about the cord assumes
>> that I can use 220. IF that is the case, On this particular plug model
the
>> two main prongs are horizontal not at an angle like my home outlet for
the
>> 220...can I change the cord to one that fits?
>
>
>Please refer to this chart (courtesy of Sheffield Pottery):
>http://www.sheffield-pottery.com/Articles.asp?ID=127
>
>The pin configuration on your plug/outlet is not just some manufacturer's
>whim. The arrangement of the pins indicates a specific voltage and current
>rating. Please note that the chart uses numbers like 125 volts and 250
>volts. These numbers refer to _maximum_ values, not nominal. Also, please
be
>aware that the drawings are not to scale. They depict only the
arrangement,
>not the physical size of the connectors.
>
>If you look at the chart you will see that the horizontal connector
>configuration is used for a 30 amp connection and the angled connector
>configuration is used for a 20 amp connection. Your kiln, which is rated
to
>draw 24 amperes, requires a 30 ampere connection.
>
>Good luck - and be safe
>
>Bruce Girrell
>
>__________________________________________________________________________
____
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Thanks again! Your answers are helpful but just a few questions about
some of the responses. I will not change the plug itself. Since the plug
should be fine, I'll spend the money on the outlet. I will also look into
having a stand made, I have some welder friends.
>>>I live in Iowa, so that means that I should have 240 not 220?
>>>Does that mean I just need to worry about the outlet?
...The outlet in question in my basement is about 6' from the fuse/breaker
box.(I wish it were in the garage!) I will look into what it would cost to
have the power run to the garage and see if that is the best route to go
as far as cost goes as opposed to paying for the ventilation.
...My garage is about 50 feet from the back of the house, so it could be
costly to have line run. If the line itself is around $3.50 a foot, it
would be less than 200.00. But the install...that could be a different
story.
>>>The tip of the sitter is not built up but it is glassy looking. How
do I know if it is kiln wash to leave or something that will stick to the
cones to remove?
>>>Does anyone know if there is any special handling that I should give
when I fire the kiln up after being dormant for so many years?
...That is the manual I downloaded, it just doesn't discuss the DK's
specifically, but that's okay- as long as it is what I needed.
>>>If I do have to use the basement in the end, should I heat shield the
ceiling? (I have just beams and my oak subfloor with oak floors over that)
>>>Any preferences on the heat shield material? Metal vs sheet heat shield?
THANK YOU AGAIN AND AGAIN!!! I am also going to take a swing at a
drying cabinet fashioned from all of the helpful ideas on ClayArt!
~~Stephanie
Arnold Howard on tue 14 nov 06
Voltage in the U.S. and Canada is 240, not 220.
A glassy surface on the Kiln Sitter cone supports may be
from a melted cone. I would clean the supports with emery
cloth. They can be removed by sliding out of the porcelain
tube.
The firing chamber of a used kiln that has been stored for
years should be vacuumed with a soft brush nozzle. (Avoid
breathing the dust.) Make sure the elements are seated in
the grooves. Bulging elements should be repaired before
firing the kiln.
Vacuum the Kiln Sitter tube assembly. First, remove the cone
supports from the Kiln Sitter tube. Then place a vacuum hose
directly over the tube. This removes not only debris but
also rust from around the pivot point.
Whenever placing a cone on the cone supports, check the
travel of the actuating rod. It should be free to move up
and down without binding and should be centered in the
oblong slot.
Obtain a Kiln Sitter firing gauge, and adjust the trigger.
That will take just a moment and will help you to become
familiar with the Kiln Sitter.
The kiln stand that you make should be level and
rock-steady. An unleveled stand can stress the firebricks. A
stand that rocks can cause the kiln to move when jarred,
knocking over ware against the sidewalls inside the kiln.
We have produced "Safe Installation of the Electric Kiln,"
which may answer questions about setting up the firing room.
You can download it here:
http://www.paragonweb.com/Instruction_Manuals.cfm
(By the way, to locate the title quickly, press Control-F,
which causes a search line to appear. Then type the first
word of the title on the search line.)
Sincerely,
Arnold Howard
Paragon Industries, L.P., Mesquite, Texas USA
ahoward@paragonweb.com / www.paragonweb.com
From: "Stephanie Albright"
> >>>I live in Iowa, so that means that I should have 240
> not 220?
> >>>Does that mean I just need to worry about the outlet?
> >>>The tip of the sitter is not built up but it is glassy
> looking. How
> do I know if it is kiln wash to leave or something that
> will stick to the
> cones to remove?
> >>>Does anyone know if there is any special handling that
> I should give
> when I fire the kiln up after being dormant for so many
> years?
>>>>If I do have to use the basement in the end, should I
>>>>heat shield the
> ceiling? (I have just beams and my oak subfloor with oak
> floors over that)
>>>>Any preferences on the heat shield material? Metal vs
>>>>sheet heat shield?
Pamela Regentin on tue 14 nov 06
While you are looking into things Stephanie, if you are thinking of the garage you may want to find out about having an electrical service entrance put there. I don't know if it is feasible to run line that far for a kiln from the existing box in the house. Someone here may. It is heavy-duty line and would probably have to go underground. When we built the barn with a shop and kiln studio we had a new service entrance put in which the electric company ran the line for. We had to dig the trench and do all the inside hook-up of course. We now have a separate meter for the shop which is convenient for knowing the production costs with the kiln.
Pam
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