Antoinette Badenhorst on tue 19 dec 06
No you're not a bialy. You also did not make the Smithsonian exhibition =
off
as something useless. Thank you to everybody that stood up and lifted =
out
the good works from this show. I did not only appreciate it, but I also
learned form those comments.
Those of us that spend lots of time on one piece do not break the so =
called
"functional" potters off to be useless and "we do not want them for =
free"
just because we're disappointed that our taste is not represented.=20
There are wonderful, wonderful production, utilarian(sp?), functional ( =
call
it what you want)potters out there. Most of them make pottery from a =
passion
and a love for clay.
=20
It does not mean that if some of us do one of a kind, time-consuming =
pieces
that we do not need money or make money. It means that we, and for that
matter the Smithsonian exhibiters have other goals than just making =
money.
Or maybe we believe in hard work that will pay of some day. Not to say =
that
other that do NOT do the Smithsonian do not work hard....in fact.....!
No one that gets into that narrow space that the Smithsonian provides
slipped in there by accident. They worked for it, bear disappointment =
after
disappointment and are persistent to get where they need to be. Since =
they
mostly stand alone, they often are alone, but they have a goal and I =
salute
them for that. If they make money from the rich in the end....good for =
them.
Antoinette Badenhorst( that went through it all...)
105 Westwood Circle
Saltillo MS, 38866
662 869 1651
www.clayandcanvas.com
www.southernartistry.org
=20
=20
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Lili =
Krakowski
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 6:09 PM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Bialys in the Snow: was The Smithsonian Show
The Opera, which Lois does not like, needs subsidies. Pop Star concerts =
are
sold out as soon as announced.
Paul was disappointed in the Smithsonian show, feeling it was =
non-functional
stuff meant to sit on the shelves of the wealthy waiting for the poorer =
to
dust it. Antoinette felt Paul's observations were "naive and arrogant" .
She has gone through phases in her work and sales and gets more pleasure
when people say they want a piece [of hers] without asking the price =
first.
"I know they [want] the piece for the value of the piece and not the =
money
value...because they value my knowledge, my expertise my time and
effort...." Antoinette also wonders whether she or Paul will have the
biggest influence on the history of art and craft, and how important =
that is
to Paul. And the moral of her story is that Paul, and I guess all of =
us,
should think of who we are, why we are that way, what we will be at the =
end
of the season, and what our role in history will be.
Lee who is not a "now now now"
kinda a guy, did "now, now, now", and bless
you for it Lee.
Beth felt beauty was in the eye of the beholder....And then
the discussion sort of
fell apart and we got lots of "loved this/hated that" spitting in the =
eye
of opposing beholders.
Meanwhile, still recovering from hideous conjunctivitis
that started with cold, and makes being spat in
the eye irritating) I sauntered out to a "dollar store" for a plastic =
pan.
And there was sign on the door: "If you haven't found a gift for that
special someone, why not a Gift Certificate from [our store)?"
I giggled, and heard a voice: who are you, what's your pitiful =
excuse,where
will
you be end of March (end of winter season) and what will be your
role in history? (To the last I replied: "A Bialy").
The notion that people
with discretionary funds value knowledge,
expertise etc. more than those who need every penny
to pay bills bothers me. Ok. It offends me. They're the ones
I sell functional ware to, who like my stuff, whom I live
among. When I make pots I am talking to them. Unless my customers
are terrible klutzes my pots will outlive me.
Yes, I know there are high income folk who buy my stuff.
But not because they value my expertise and knowledge any higher
than I value theirs. Or less than the guy who can fling a pizza
crust 6 feet up above his head.
And tell me this. I can tell with the touch of my finger if clay
is the right consistency to be thrown. Does that make my time
more/less valuable than that of a neighbor who can pick up a handful
of hay and tell if it is dry enough to bale? I pull a mean handle; does
that
make my skill greater/lesser than that of a farmer who can milk a =
difficult
cow? Is my diagnoses of glaze defects more or less real knowledge than
that of the mechanic who hears me tooling up the hill and knows which
of my pickup's bearings is shot?
I am not evaluating or judging or anything people who make clay things
for people with buckets of money who want to put it on a shelf in
their mansion. But I certainly think that the equation of buckets of =
money
spent on pots=3D good taste, appreciation of skill, knowledge etc. =
troubling.
So by the end of March , D.V., I will be here,
A Bialy in History.
Lili Krakowski
Be of good courage
_________________________________________________________________________=
___
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
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Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Lili Krakowski on tue 19 dec 06
The Opera, which Lois does not like, needs subsidies. Pop Star concerts are
sold out as soon as announced.
Paul was disappointed in the Smithsonian show, feeling it was non-functional
stuff meant to sit on the shelves of the wealthy waiting for the poorer to
dust it. Antoinette felt Paul's observations were "naive and arrogant" .
She has gone through phases in her work and sales and gets more pleasure
when people say they want a piece [of hers] without asking the price first.
"I know they [want] the piece for the value of the piece and not the money
value...because they value my knowledge, my expertise my time and
effort...." Antoinette also wonders whether she or Paul will have the
biggest influence on the history of art and craft, and how important that is
to Paul. And the moral of her story is that Paul, and I guess all of us,
should think of who we are, why we are that way, what we will be at the end
of the season, and what our role in history will be.
Lee who is not a "now now now"
kinda a guy, did "now, now, now", and bless
you for it Lee.
Beth felt beauty was in the eye of the beholder....And then
the discussion sort of
fell apart and we got lots of "loved this/hated that" spitting in the eye
of opposing beholders.
Meanwhile, still recovering from hideous conjunctivitis
that started with cold, and makes being spat in
the eye irritating) I sauntered out to a "dollar store" for a plastic pan.
And there was sign on the door: "If you haven't found a gift for that
special someone, why not a Gift Certificate from [our store)?"
I giggled, and heard a voice: who are you, what's your pitiful excuse,where
will
you be end of March (end of winter season) and what will be your
role in history? (To the last I replied: "A Bialy").
The notion that people
with discretionary funds value knowledge,
expertise etc. more than those who need every penny
to pay bills bothers me. Ok. It offends me. They're the ones
I sell functional ware to, who like my stuff, whom I live
among. When I make pots I am talking to them. Unless my customers
are terrible klutzes my pots will outlive me.
Yes, I know there are high income folk who buy my stuff.
But not because they value my expertise and knowledge any higher
than I value theirs. Or less than the guy who can fling a pizza
crust 6 feet up above his head.
And tell me this. I can tell with the touch of my finger if clay
is the right consistency to be thrown. Does that make my time
more/less valuable than that of a neighbor who can pick up a handful
of hay and tell if it is dry enough to bale? I pull a mean handle; does
that
make my skill greater/lesser than that of a farmer who can milk a difficult
cow? Is my diagnoses of glaze defects more or less real knowledge than
that of the mechanic who hears me tooling up the hill and knows which
of my pickup's bearings is shot?
I am not evaluating or judging or anything people who make clay things
for people with buckets of money who want to put it on a shelf in
their mansion. But I certainly think that the equation of buckets of money
spent on pots= good taste, appreciation of skill, knowledge etc. troubling.
So by the end of March , D.V., I will be here,
A Bialy in History.
Lili Krakowski
Be of good courage
Lee Love on wed 20 dec 06
On 12/20/06, Antoinette Badenhorst wrote:
> It does not mean that if some of us do one of a kind, time-consuming pieces
> that we do not need money or make money. It means that we, and for that
> matter the Smithsonian exhibiters have other goals than just making money.
> Or maybe we believe in hard work that will pay of some day. Not to say that
> other that do NOT do the Smithsonian do not work hard....in fact.....!
I make both kinds of work. Woodfire is very time consuming
and labor intensive. Maybe more intensive than more "fussy" work.
But you have to learn to let go of control a little bit in doing it.
Like Hamada told Voulkos about his tight fussy, controlled pots he
showed Hamada, "you should let the clay work for you a little bit."
Hamada helped "unleash" Voulkos .
I like diversity. Intellectual work certainly has its
place. But so does sensitive and intuitive work that has feeling.
This aspect is independent of how long it took to make it.
--
Lee in Mashiko, Japan
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
http://potters.blogspot.com/
"Let the beauty we love be what we do." - Rumi
"When we all do better. We ALL do better." -Paul Wellstone
Antoinette Badenhorst on wed 20 dec 06
Well, then I do not see why you got into this in the first place....we =
are
on the same page. Maybe you did not read the bold lines on the bottom of =
my
first e-mail or maybe you put a shoe that does not fit on your =
foot...who
knows. This is all about passion, honesty and truth in one's approach to
your work; does not matter if you only make soap dishes! It is also =
about
appreciating and respecting each other and each other's approach.=20
That does not mean that we can not critique the work and learn from =
that,
but then it should be constructive and not from a "how on earth...." or =
"I
know it all" I myself had a few questions about some of the pieces; some
were answered, others not. Not all the work accepted by the Smithsonian
falls into my personal taste. That does not mean that I have the right =
to
belittle that on a public forum
It is also about appreciating and respecting venues from where we find =
our
customers. There are zillions of opportunities for many different
approaches. I hope my message is clear now, if not before.
And by the way.....porcelain in an electric kiln at ^10 have its own way
also....believe me! I do not need Hamada to tell me that, the clay =
itself
teaches me every day!
Best wishes.
Antoinette Badenhorst
105 Westwood Circle
Saltillo MS, 38866
662 869 1651
www.clayandcanvas.com
www.southernartistry.org
=20
=20
-----Original Message-----
From: Clayart [mailto:CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG] On Behalf Of Lee Love
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 8:23 AM
To: CLAYART@LSV.CERAMICS.ORG
Subject: Re: Bialys in the Snow: was The Smithsonian Show
On 12/20/06, Antoinette Badenhorst wrote:
> It does not mean that if some of us do one of a kind, time-consuming
pieces
> that we do not need money or make money. It means that we, and for =
that
> matter the Smithsonian exhibiters have other goals than just making =
money.
> Or maybe we believe in hard work that will pay of some day. Not to say
that
> other that do NOT do the Smithsonian do not work hard....in fact.....!
I make both kinds of work. Woodfire is very time consuming
and labor intensive. Maybe more intensive than more "fussy" work.
But you have to learn to let go of control a little bit in doing it.
Like Hamada told Voulkos about his tight fussy, controlled pots he
showed Hamada, "you should let the clay work for you a little bit."
Hamada helped "unleash" Voulkos .
I like diversity. Intellectual work certainly has its
place. But so does sensitive and intuitive work that has feeling.
This aspect is independent of how long it took to make it.
--
Lee in Mashiko, Japan
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
http://potters.blogspot.com/
"Let the beauty we love be what we do." - Rumi
"When we all do better. We ALL do better." -Paul Wellstone
_________________________________________________________________________=
___
__
Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
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