Eloise VanderBilt on tue 28 mar 00
For ten years I have been using the word bisque and for ten years I have
wondered when and from where the word came into the pottery world. I assume
from the spelling it is from France but no pottery book I've read explains
it. I eat soft BISCUITS and honey, I eat hard cookies called BISCUITS.
Neither sound like the bisquing process. Some one with a more comprehensive
dictionary than I have access to may be able to help me.
Fabienne Cassman on wed 29 mar 00
Hello Eloise,
according to Hamer&Hamer's Potter's Dictionary, the term BISCUIT originated
in the 17th c. in France when tin glazing was introduced; it necessitated
an extra firing.
Anyone can explain why "tin"? TIA
Cheers,
Faye
--
Pottery Toolbox http://clay.justnet.com
Virtual Gallery http://clay.justnet.com/cgallery/
Yes, I have learned from my mistakes...
I can reproduce them exactly.
rickmahaffey on wed 29 mar 00
Eloise,
In some older English books I have seen what we in the US call Bisque
referred to as Biscuit as in Biscuit fire. Some clays have the
appearance of a hard biscuit when they have been through a bisque
firing. I seem to recall that Dr. Herbert Sanders would use that term
on occasion when I was in his class at San Jose State Univ. back before
the turn on the century. :)
Rick Mahaffey
Tacoma Washington, USA
Eloise VanderBilt wrote:
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> For ten years I have been using the word bisque and for ten years I have
> wondered when and from where the word came into the pottery world. I assume
> from the spelling it is from France but no pottery book I've read explains
> it. I eat soft BISCUITS and honey, I eat hard cookies called BISCUITS.
> Neither sound like the bisquing process. Some one with a more comprehensive
> dictionary than I have access to may be able to help me.
Wade Blocker on wed 29 mar 00
----------
> From: Eloise VanderBilt
> To: CLAYART@LSV.UKY.EDU
> Subject: where did bisque come from?
> Date: Tuesday, March 28, 2000 11:27 AM
>
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> For ten years I have been using the word bisque and for ten years I have
> wondered when and from where the word came into the pottery world. I
assume
> from the spelling it is from France but no pottery book I've read
explains
> it. I eat soft BISCUITS and honey, I eat hard cookies called BISCUITS.
> Neither sound like the bisquing process. Some one with a more
comprehensive
> dictionary than I have access to may be able to help me.
Eloise,
The word biscuit comes from French and Latin. -bis twice+coctus,past
participle of coquere to cook. Webster's gives one meaning of the word to
refer to unglazed pottery after the first firing.
In the US and France"bisque" is preferred.
According to the Oxford English dictionary "the regular form in England
from 16th to l8th Century was bisket,as still pronounced;the current
biscuit is a senseless adoption of the modern French spelling without the
French pronunciation." In pottery the name given to porcelain and other
pottery-ware after having undergone the first firing,and before being
glazed,painted or otherwise embellished.
The word of course refers to hard dry flat bread originally and
also a very light tan color.
Mia in ABQ
Erika Benson on wed 29 mar 00
My dictionary tells me, eventually, that bisque comes from Medieval
Latin "biscoctus" - which meant twice-cooked bread. Could also refer to
the color of the bisqued ware -
Erika
DeLana Hornbeck on wed 29 mar 00
Hi Eloise,
The story I have heard over the years is, that bisque means ,in French,
cookie which resembles the feeling and porosity of the clay when it has
been first fired.........hardened and still absorbant so it can recieve the
glaze.
DeLana
delh@enter.net
----- Original Message -----
From: Eloise VanderBilt
To:
Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2000 12:27 PM
Subject: where did bisque come from?
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> For ten years I have been using the word bisque and for ten years I have
> wondered when and from where the word came into the pottery world. I
assume
> from the spelling it is from France but no pottery book I've read explains
> it. I eat soft BISCUITS and honey, I eat hard cookies called BISCUITS.
> Neither sound like the bisquing process. Some one with a more
comprehensive
> dictionary than I have access to may be able to help me.
>
Janet Kaiser on wed 29 mar 00
Eloise,
I talked to Frank and Janet Hamer about this after the "biscuit joke" some
time ago...
According to them, "bisque" is used to describe the first firing of factory
ware in the ceramics industry. "Biscuit" firing is what you do in a studio
pottery... at least in the UK.
A lot of young UK potters have started to use the term "bisque"... I suppose
it sounds more sophisticated?
A natural confusion occurs when using "biscuit" to you people across the
pond... Remember our "biscuits" are your "cookies". Your "biscuits" are
variously known as scones, muffins, cakes, etc. over here.
Accept a biscuit is a cookie and you will see where the expression comes
from. A biscuit/cookie has the same touch and consistency of a biscuit-fired
pot. Not so hard on the teeth as a pot mind you, but you know what I mean?
The confusion between a biscuit and a cookie is probably why the French
expression "bisque" is preferred in the US. It all means the same thing
though. I say "biscuit" because that is what I was taught and have always
heard said and also because it is easier to spell! There are some pretty
strange variations on "bisque" if you look through the archives...
Why do the French say "bisque"? Well they think of biscuits being soft too!
Usually a sponge finger is called a biscuit!
Hope this helps rather than confuses!
Janet Kaiser
The Chapel of Art, Criccieth LL52 0EA, GB-Wales
Home of The International Potters Path
TEL: (01766) 523570
WEB: http://www.the-coa.org.uk
EMAIL: postbox@the-coa.org.uk
----- Original Message -----
From: Eloise VanderBilt
To:
Sent: 28 March 2000 19:27
Subject: where did bisque come from?
> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> For ten years I have been using the word bisque and for ten years I have
> wondered when and from where the word came into the pottery world. I
assume
> from the spelling it is from France but no pottery book I've read explains
> it. I eat soft BISCUITS and honey, I eat hard cookies called BISCUITS.
> Neither sound like the bisquing process. Some one with a more
comprehensive
> dictionary than I have access to may be able to help me.
>
Mike Gordon on wed 29 mar 00
Hi,
My old ceramics teacher,Vernon Coykendall ( Corky) Told me the term
Bisque came from the english , referring to "hard Bisquits" Mike
ferenc jakab on wed 29 mar 00
I'm not sure about the origin of 'bisque'. I've always assumed it was from
the French too. However I do know that it is mostly used incorrectly. The
state that we usually call bisque is actually biscuit. I.e. where the ware
(pardon the pun) is fired to a temperature lower than that to which the
glaze will be fired. Bisque is used in industrial production where the ware
is fired to a higher temperature than the temperature of the glost firing.
Feri.
Murray & Bacia Edelman on wed 29 mar 00
At 01:27 PM 03/28/2000 EST, you wrote:
>----------------------------Original message----------------------------
>For ten years I have been using the word bisque and for ten years I have
>wondered when and from where the word came into the pottery world. I assume
>from the spelling it is from France but no pottery book I've read explains
>it. I eat soft BISCUITS and honey, I eat hard cookies called BISCUITS.
>Neither sound like the bisquing process. Some one with a more comprehensive
>dictionary than I have access to may be able to help me.
In the OLDEN DAYS when I first started in clay, the word Biscuit was also
used a great deal. In my dictionary, under: biscuit, one definition is:
ceramics. Pottery that has been fired once but not glazed. Also called
"bisque."
And the same definition appears under Bisque as does : a thick rich soup
etc etc.
Bacia Madison, WI
Jenny Lewis on wed 29 mar 00
Hi Eloise
This is one of those coincidences - I was watching a televdision
documentary just recently, and learned the origin of the word
biscuit. According to this programme, which was about World War I,
something called hard tack that was issued to the troops was a type
of biscuit (by the way, in this neck of the woods what we call
biscuits are what the Americans call cookies), and the name came
about because they were baked and then, to toughen them, baked again.
Result, very hard objects that the soldiers could carry around, not
as breakable or crumbly as once-baked biscuits would be. From the
French bis-cuit meaning twice cooked.
But why in pottery? Dunno, but I suppose the hard tack looked and
felt like fired ceramics, probably tasted like it too, only more
nourishing. Why spelled bisque? Dunno that either, but maybe
that's how it was in French originally. Which makes me wonder,
lobster bisque is a soup, but does not feel like ceramics. I know
I'm not a great cook, but even I could not ... hmm, shouldn't tempt
the fates here, should I.
Jenny Lewis
overlooking Regents Park
late spring, official summer,
bitterly cold, windy miserable lousy weather
Paul Lewing on thu 30 mar 00
I almost posted this comment back when we were talking about what is
porcelain, but with the discussion of the word "bisque", I just couldn't
pass it up again.
In the tile industry, any tile with a very low absorbency is referred to
as porcelain. It won't be translucent, it may not be high-fired, and it
might not even be white, but if it's low-absorbency, it's porcelain to
them. I've seen dark brown tile referred as porcelain.
And "bisque"? That's any tile that's not porcelain. Doesn't matter
what temperature it's been fired to, doesn't matter if it's not going to
get another firing, doesn't matter if it's got a glaze on it. If the
absorbency is high enough, it's bisque to them.
Go figure.
Paul Lewing, Seattle
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