Janet Hlozik Taylor on sat 23 aug 03
A similar, but not the same, thread appeared in
Clayart a few years back.
How will putting a kiln in my basement affect my home
owner's insurance? I am _not_ a professional potter.
Do I have to inform my insurer? What if something
goes dreadfuly wrong (such as a fire)? Someone
suggested that I call another insurance company, one
not connected to me, and ask them. Any other
suggestions or experiences that you can share?
Thanks in advance.
Janet Hlozik Taylor
hlozik@yahoo.com
__________________________________
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Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
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Kathi LeSueur on sat 23 aug 03
hlozik@YAHOO.COM wrote:
>How will putting a kiln in my basement affect my home
>owner's insurance? I am _not_ a professional potter.
>Do I have to inform my insurer? What if something
>goes dreadfuly wrong (such as a fire)? Someone
>suggested that I call another insurance company, one
>not connected to me, and ask them. Any other
>suggestions or experiences that you can share?>>
>
Do NOT hide anything from your insurance company. If you suffer a loss
it will be grounds to deny your claim. Tell the company you have it, or
want to have it. If they will not insure you, go to an independent
insurance agent and tell them to find a carrier who will insure you with
a kiln. The big insurers, Allstate, State Farm, etc. do not want to take
the risk.
Kathi
>
>
>
>
Kenneth D. Westfall on sun 24 aug 03
Defiantly do not hide that fact you have one or want one but do use word
like hobby! Hobby electric kilns seem to make a difference to some
insurance company versus having a full time pottery in your basement.
>hlozik@YAHOO.COM wrote:
>
> >How will putting a kiln in my basement affect my home
> >owner's insurance? I am _not_ a professional potter.
> >Do I have to inform my insurer? What if something
> >goes dreadfuly wrong (such as a fire)? Someone
> >suggested that I call another insurance company, one
> >not connected to me, and ask them. Any other
> >suggestions or experiences that you can share?>>
> >
>
>Do NOT hide anything from your insurance company. If you suffer a loss
>it will be grounds to deny your claim. Tell the company you have it, or
>want to have it. If they will not insure you, go to an independent
>insurance agent and tell them to find a carrier who will insure you with
>a kiln. The big insurers, Allstate, State Farm, etc. do not want to take
>the risk.
>
>Kathi
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
>melpots@pclink.com.
Kenneth D. Westfall
Pine Hill Pottery
R.D. #2 Box 6AA
Harrisville, WV 26362
kenneth@pinehillpottery.com
http://www.pinehillpottery.com
John Rodgers on sun 24 aug 03
In any case, be sure your kiln wiring is done by a competent licensed
electrician.
As for insurance, I would approach the company with the "I'm thinking
about a hobby kiln" line. If you have a UL listing and sticker for the
kiln you are way ahead of the game. When talking to an agent tell them
your kiln is UL rated. I won't tell you what I think about UL, but use
the game to your advantage..
Give what they ask of you, but don't volunteer a lot. Emphasize the
hobby aspect. You can decide later about the business aspect of things.
Then you will have to give more info about the kiln and its use.
Good Luck,
Regards,
John Rodgers
Birmingham, AL
Janet Hlozik Taylor wrote:
>A similar, but not the same, thread appeared in
>Clayart a few years back.
>
>How will putting a kiln in my basement affect my home
>owner's insurance? I am _not_ a professional potter.
>Do I have to inform my insurer? What if something
>goes dreadfuly wrong (such as a fire)? Someone
>suggested that I call another insurance company, one
>not connected to me, and ask them. Any other
>suggestions or experiences that you can share?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Janet Hlozik Taylor
>hlozik@yahoo.com
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
>http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
>
>______________________________________________________________________________
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at melpots@pclink.com.
>
>
>
Kathi LeSueur on mon 25 aug 03
j_rodgers@CHARTER.NET wrote:
> In any case, be sure your kiln wiring is done by a competent licensed
> electrician.
>
> As for insurance, I would approach the company with the "I'm thinking
> about a hobby kiln" line.>>
This is fine advice EXCEPT if you have a loss. Don't think that the
insurance company will be so naive as to take your word that this is a
hobby. In fact, they will do everything possible to prove it was NOT a
hobby so that they can deny the claim. I know three potters who were
listed as "hobbie potters" when they really were making a living from
it. Two were advised by their agents to claim the "hobby" status. All
three suffered a loss and none were ever paid. If you are a "hobby
potter", fine. But, you don't have to make a significant protion of your
income from pots to be considered not in the "hobby" class. In fact,
just selling your work on a regular basis can be a problem.
Tell them what you are doing and find a carrier that will cover you.
They do exist but you'll probably have to go to an independent agent to
find one.
Kathi
Arnold Howard on mon 25 aug 03
We have found that regarding electric kilns, insurance companies come in
three categories:
1) Some insurance companies simply don't insure kilns. No matter what
you tell them, they won't change their minds.
2) Other insurance companies need extra information--i.e., the kiln is
UL Listed--before they will OK the kiln.
3) Still other insurance companies have no problem with kilns and don't
even care if you have one.
If an insurance company refuses to insure a kiln, find a company in
category 2 or 3.
A properly installed and operated electric kiln is very safe. Do not
leave it unattended during operation, and disconnect the power when not
in use. Keep flammable materials out of the firing room. If you fire the
kiln in a garage, remove cans of paint and gasoline. Store them in a
separate building such as a garden shed. If you follow these basic rules
and the others listed in the manual, your kiln will be a source of joy
rather than of worry.
Sincerely,
Arnold Howard
Paragon Industries, L.P.
arnoldhoward@att.net
From: Janet Hlozik Taylor
> How will putting a kiln in my basement affect my home
> owner's insurance? I am _not_ a professional potter.
> Do I have to inform my insurer? What if something
> goes dreadfuly wrong (such as a fire)?
Brad Sondahl on mon 25 aug 03
I'd like to hear more about these three incidents, Kathi. I've never met a potter who had a fire from their kiln, and it would be educational to hear what happened in each of these cases. I nearly had a fire once when the plug developed a bad connection and arced, but caught it before it spread to the structure.
Kathi LeSueur wrote: I know three potters who were
listed as "hobbie potters" when they really were making a living from
it. Two were advised by their agents to claim the "hobby" status. All
three suffered a loss and none were ever paid. If you are a "hobby
potter",
Brad Sondahl
--
For original art, music, pottery, and literature, visit my homepage
http://sondahl.com
Pottery sales page http://sondahl.freeyellow.com
My music site at mp3.com http://www.mp3.com/stations/sondahl
Kathi LeSueur on mon 25 aug 03
bsondahl@EARTHLINK.NET wrote:
>I'd like to hear more about these three incidents, Kathi. I've never met a potter who had a fire from their kiln, and it would be educational to hear what happened in each of these cases. I nearly had a fire once when the plug developed a bad connection and arced, but caught it before it spread to the structure.
>
>
>Kathi LeSueur wrote: I know three potters who were
>listed as "hobbie potters" when they really were making a living from
>it. Two were advised by their agents to claim the "hobby" status. All
>three suffered a loss and none were ever paid. If you are a "hobby
>potter",>>
>
The one I know the most about is a local potter named Steve Olzewski,
who does large raku sculpures mainly. I believe the carrier was State
Farm, but can't be sure. It was several years ago. Steve's studio, in a
barn at his house, was insured under the "hobby" category at the
suggestion of his agent. Steve's studio caught fire one night and burned
to the ground before the fire department could get there and put it out.
When he submitted the claim it was denied. The carrier ruled that his
pottery was not a hobby, but a business, and since they hadn't insured
the business they would not pay on the claim. It didn't matter that the
agent made the suggestion originally, Just try to prove that one. And,
it didn't matter that his claywork was not his primary source of income
at the time.
Kathi
>
>
>
>
L. P. Skeen on tue 26 aug 03
What does CNA MEAN?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kathi LeSueur"
> >CNA. It's sold through independent agents throughout the country.
David Lane on tue 26 aug 03
Ok then, could someone please give us the names of some insurance
companies that *don't* have a problem with a kiln in your home?
Thanks
>2) Other insurance companies need extra information--i.e., the kiln is
>UL Listed--before they will OK the kiln.
>
>3) Still other insurance companies have no problem with kilns and don't
>even care if you have one.
>
>If an insurance company refuses to insure a kiln, find a company in
>category 2 or 3.
>
>A properly installed and operated electric kiln is very safe. Do not
>leave it unattended during operation, and disconnect the power when not
>in use. Keep flammable materials out of the firing room. If you fire the
>kiln in a garage, remove cans of paint and gasoline. Store them in a
>separate building such as a garden shed. If you follow these basic rules
>and the others listed in the manual, your kiln will be a source of joy
>rather than of worry.
>
>Sincerely,
>
>Arnold Howard
>Paragon Industries, L.P.
>arnoldhoward@att.net
>
>
>
>
>From: Janet Hlozik Taylor
>> How will putting a kiln in my basement affect my home
>> owner's insurance? I am _not_ a professional potter.
>> Do I have to inform my insurer? What if something
>> goes dreadfuly wrong (such as a fire)?
>
>__________________________________________________________________________
____
>Send postings to clayart@lsv.ceramics.org
>
>You may look at the archives for the list or change your subscription
>settings from http://www.ceramics.org/clayart/
>
>Moderator of the list is Mel Jacobson who may be reached at
melpots@pclink.com.
Hank Murrow on tue 26 aug 03
On Tuesday, August 26, 2003, at 07:55 AM, David Lane wrote:
> Ok then, could someone please give us the names of some insurance
> companies that *don't* have a problem with a kiln in your home?
Good day;
I recently was cancelled by Mutual of Enumclaw. Asked around in my
Local Clay group. Shopped. Found that AllState would do it for a very
reasonable fee, including liability ins. to cover customers in my
showroom and studio. $388/year, and they came out and inspected the
kiln and its connection through the roof thoroughly. I am now happy and
covered.
Cheers, Hank
www.murrow.biz/hank
Kathi LeSueur on tue 26 aug 03
k4zzr@BELLSOUTH.NET wrote:
>Ok then, could someone please give us the names of some insurance
>companies that *don't* have a problem with a kiln in your home?
>
>CNA. It's sold through independent agents throughout the country.
>
Kathi
>
>
Susan Fox-Hirschmann on wed 27 aug 03
The insurance companies that do not have a problem with kilns in your home
are:
Association and Society Insurance Co...800-638-2610
(the policy is called Craftsman protection Plan) and was recommended to me
in the 80's by ACC)--it covered my equipment, my work in transit, and my
supplies that were in my basement
But since I now have a separate studio.....and my home is under
State Farm Insurance (and so are my vehicles)....I think I could get a
better
"property/casuality deal" with State Farm (they do reduce their fees when
all your
insurance is with them. I made a point of telling him I was with ASI/CPP
for the last 19 years and made NO claims. He said that would impact on the
premium.
He was the underwriter that visited yesterday and merely wanted to see that
every room in the studio had fire extinguishers and that the kilns had as he
called it "automatic cut offs" (CONES!) and inspected the building which is
basically masonry and Windows but has a "firewall" built around the duct work
(required by
overregulated Fairfax county, VA)
I have the insurance....now just a matter of trying to get a decent
premium....
Best of luck in this hastle.
Susan
Annandale, VA
Carl Finch on wed 27 aug 03
At 11:20 PM 8/26/03 -0400, L. P. Skeen wrote:
>What does CNA MEAN?
It's the company's name. Readallaboudit:
http://www.cna.com
--Carl
in Medford, Oregon
Kathi LeSueur on wed 27 aug 03
lpskeen@LIVING-TREE.NET wrote:
>What does CNA MEAN?
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Kathi LeSueur"
> =20
>
>>>CNA. It's sold through independent agents throughout the country.
>>> =20
>>>
>
>___________________________________________________________________________=
___
>I don't know what CNA stands for. I just know it's one of the biggest resid=
ential/commercial insurers in the country and any independent agent who writ=
es commercial insurance will have heard of them. You can combine all of your=
needs (home, studio, auto) under one policy with them. We used CNA until la=
st year when our agent transfered us to Michigan INsurance Company because t=
hey had better rates but just as good a record on claims paid. You need to u=
nderstand the difference between an "independent agent" and a "company" agen=
t. A company agent works for the company that writes the insurance. So you h=
ave an Allstate agent or a State Farm agent. Those agents only sell their co=
mpany's insurance. An "independent" agent works you. They sell insurance fro=
m lots of different companies and can find you the best one for your particu=
lar situation. When it comes to claims, the company agent's job is to pay ou=
t as little of the companies money as possible. An "independent" agent has n=
o such relationship with the carrier. Though you will probably deal with the=
claims department from the carrier, if you aren't happy with their service=20=
you can go back to your "independent" agent and have them fight the battle f=
or you. If a carrier for an independent gets to many complaints, the indepen=
dent will just stop writing insurance for the.
>
Kathi
>=20
>
> =20
>
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